Holiday greetings

[boomer]

Today is Indigenous People Day. An official holiday in some states and citied observed in place of Columbus Day.which is no longer observed.

Doesn't really add an additional day of play to thr holiday to the calendar  but still a good excuse, if one is needed, to get outside.

Enjoy the day and the fall season.

[Pete Bog]

I kinda miss Columbus day. A day of exploration and discovery. It was the one day of the year when we could go out and explore until we discovered a Cadillac or BMW and declare it as our own. At least for the day. Unlike Columbus though, we would give it back at the end of the day!!

Hey Ma! Look what I discovered!
Put that back where you found it.
But nobody was using it!
(grumble-grumble)
 

[Mannlicher]

the myth of the poor red man is over hyped.   They were no more noble than any other group.  They were focused on rape, pillage, theft and slavery like all other primitive people.  Never even invented the wheel. 
You cannot find a single group of folks living anywhere, that have not been shoved around, had their land 'stolen', been enslaved and abused.  Those same folks have in their turn, been the land stealers,  the abusers, the slavers. 
There is no way to sift back through time and change history.  If one group is guilty and needs to 'pay restitution', then we all need to.   My Irish great grandparents were treated as badly by the British as the indians were.   Land stolen, enslaved, killed in their millions.  No one is expecting the English to pay restitution now.
I still support Columbus Day.   We would not be having this conversation now if he had not sailed over.

[wsdstan]

Agreed in spades

[Pete Bog]

Hmmm, how did we get from dancing bananas and laughing heads to an angry dissertation? 

Life's rough.  Without a sense of humor? Oh you poor soul. My sympathies to you.



 

[Moe M.]

Hmmm, how did we get from dancing bananas and laughing heads to an angry dissertation? 

Life's rough.  Without a sense of humor? Oh you poor soul. My sympathies to you.

 Really,  this country and the rest of the world for that matter is under siege by a radical entity bent on "the big reset", new world order, one world government, using racism, economic class division, and destroying the world's economy,  their goal is to rebuild with a ruling class and a slave/peasant worker class dependent on the ruling government (aka the masters),  and you are so ignorant that you ask such a foolish question while speaking down your nose at those members who dare post the truth and resist the yoke placed at their feet.
 IMHO it's you who is soul less and should be begging of their sympathy toward you. 

[boomer]

Hmmm, how did we get from dancing bananas and laughing heads to an angry dissertation? 

Life's rough.  Without a sense of humor? Oh you poor soul. My sympathies to you.

 Really,  this country and the rest of the world for that matter is under siege by a radical entity bent on "the big reset", new world order, one world government, using racism, economic class division, and destroying the world's economy,  their goal is to rebuild with a ruling class and a slave/peasant worker class dependent on the ruling government (aka the masters),  and you are so ignorant that you ask such a foolish question while speaking down your nose at those members who dare post the truth and resist the yoke placed at their feet.
 IMHO it's you who is soul less and should be begging of their sympathy toward you.

An interesting exchange indeed. Not exactly a rational response but one can admit the emotional content and vitriol are exemplary. Exemplary of what may be another matter though.

[boomer]

the myth of the poor red man is over hyped.   They were no more noble than any other group.  They were focused on rape, pillage, theft and slavery like all other primitive people.  Never even invented the wheel. 
You cannot find a single group of folks living anywhere, that have not been shoved around, had their land 'stolen', been enslaved and abused.  Those same folks have in their turn, been the land stealers,  the abusers, the slavers. 
There is no way to sift back through time and change history.  If one group is guilty and needs to 'pay restitution', then we all need to.   My Irish great grandparents were treated as badly by the British as the indians were.   Land stolen, enslaved, killed in their millions.  No one is expecting the English to pay restitution now.
I still support Columbus Day.   We would not be having this conversation now if he had not sailed over.

History and context arr always relevant. On a technological level the original inhabitants of the continent lived on a stone  age level while the Europeans lived on an a more technologically advanced level. Mayan toys btw used wheels. It was European social concepts however that determined the eventual out come as much as a lack of natural resistance to diseases for which Europeans had some levels of acquired immunity 

Indirectly Citing the Enclosure Acts and the Irish Famine correctly, I believe, makes the point that social concepts are more at fault than we often care to recognize. It was true then and it is true now. Such is our world.

[Mannlicher]

the point being missed here is that the american indians were nothing special with regards as to who/what they were or how they were treated by others.  They were guilty of doing to others all the things that so piously  complain were done to them.

[Pete Bog]

the point being missed here is that the american indians were nothing special with regards as to who/what they were or how they were treated by others.  They were guilty of doing to others all the things that so piously  complain were done to them.

I understand that Manny. But, the question remains, how did you get from Well Wishes and laughing emojis to such an angry outburst?

[Pete Bog]

 Really,  this country and the rest of the world for that matter is under siege by a radical entity bent on "the big reset", new world order, one world government, using racism, economic class division, and destroying the world's economy,  their goal is to rebuild with a ruling class and a slave/peasant worker class dependent on the ruling government (aka the masters),  and you are so ignorant that you ask such a foolish question while speaking down your nose at those members who dare post the truth and resist the yoke placed at their feet.
 IMHO it's you who is soul less and should be begging of their sympathy toward you.

    Just who are these people? You have referenced them many times in your posts. Why don't you call them out, bring them kicking and screaming into the daylight. You never identify them. No direct quotations, or references to news organisations that have ID'd them. As much as you talk about THEM, one would almost think you were on a first name basis . It doesn't take much of a stretch of the imagination to think that they are your own personal Boogiemen.
    Cute little buzz words like "the big reset", new world order, yoke placed at their feet, etc., make it sound like you listen to too much AM talk radio and can't generate an original thought.

    There. I started out in the topic with an attempt at humor and now look where we're at. Thanks Manny, sure is easy to get Moe goin' ain't it? 

[boomer]

Maybe part of the frothing forth is just what folks in the Spit and Whittle Club do. Its thei right after all. From reefer madness nonsense to jitterbugging to (gasp) rock and roll to ignoring hair cut rituals to whatever elders have always been inclined to read the time, any time, as the end of civilization forgetting their cohort was once targeted in an earlier time.

But today there's more. We all recognize that regular folks have been getting the fouled end of the stick for a while now. Folks who follow the data know it, folks who live it certainly know and our self identified elites sure as heck know it. But we have become victims 2 or 3 or more times over. We have become so effectively conditioned in learned helplessness we don't know up from down, right from left, north from south.

There are no hordes at the southern border intent on raping our dogs and kicking our wives while handing out crack to babies. There are no "Them" or "They" or Socialists or Communists waging secret replacement campaigns. There is none of the other nonsense peddled on talk radio, polemical cable shows or any of the rest regardless of political labels. Its all just smoke and mirrors. Hypocrisy.

People fall for it because it seems the only option available. Simple bait and switch. PT Barnum. Victorian flea circus. Can't breath the air because of pollution? What are you going to do call up Exxon and complain? Want to pass legislation to do whatever to benefit  regular folks? How can you afford a to buy a Legislator when ends barely meet and your kids have little to look forward to? The list goes on. We all know it

There is nothing new here. Romans called it Divide Et Imperium". Greeks favored the scape goat. In the end its all the same con. Regular folks fight for scraps brushed off the banquet table we provide.

Once citizens can be convinced we're all in this alone its easy to make us forget we were ever in all this together.

In 1861 to 1865 we killed each other in staggering numbers over the question of chattle slavery and agrarian economics. Very few of the combatants ever had or ever could have owned a slave.  Didn't matter though. It was, after, all about the money.

Its always about the money.

Today we see the advent of new technologies that will transform our society in fundamental ways. We are also being led into tearing ourselves apart. Seems the old con still works.

Its still about the money.

Sometimes i disagree with folks here and they with me but there's never a time when i wish anyone ill or would turn anyone in need away.

I know we're all in this together.

[Moe M.]

 Really,  this country and the rest of the world for that matter is under siege by a radical entity bent on "the big reset", new world order, one world government, using racism, economic class division, and destroying the world's economy,  their goal is to rebuild with a ruling class and a slave/peasant worker class dependent on the ruling government (aka the masters),  and you are so ignorant that you ask such a foolish question while speaking down your nose at those members who dare post the truth and resist the yoke placed at their feet.
 IMHO it's you who is soul less and should be begging of their sympathy toward you.

 Oh, they exist alright, you just can't see them because your ignorance keeps getting in your way,  they are being brought into the light your're just so blinded by small mindedness that you refuse to look, not that long ago this country was recovering from our first black communist president,  the economy was doing great, unemployment was low,  minorities were enjoying opportunities they never had, manufacturing was coming back, taxes were resonable, for the first time in decades we were energy independent,  and the rest of the world was if not totally peaceful, it was at least orderly,  and some long fighting enemies were forming friendly relations and alliances,  inflation was held in a normal function and income for all was increasing.
 Then came the coup through trickery, deceit, thievery,  and the wide spread corruption of the media and big tech, the perfect storm, take a real look around today, nothing is going right,  our freedoms, our institutions, our economy, all are being assaulted, and if we complain we risk loosing all we have, some have been imprisoned for speaking out,  oh, yes, they exist alright, and you two are card carrying members of THEM,  how's that for dragging them out into the bright light of day.
 Take the last word if you want it, but I'm done with your Bull $chitt for now.  ^'^
   

[Mannlicher]

the point being missed here is that the american indians were nothing special with regards as to who/what they were or how they were treated by others.  They were guilty of doing to others all the things that so piously  complain were done to them.

I understand that Manny. But, the question remains, how did you get from Well Wishes and laughing emojis to such an angry outburst?

angry, Pete?  Where is there any anger being shown?  I see it as a reasoned, calm discussion of misplaced emotion.

[Pete Bog]

the myth of the poor red man is over hyped.   They were no more noble than any other group.  They were focused on rape, pillage, theft and slavery like all other primitive people.  Never even invented the wheel. 
You cannot find a single group of folks living anywhere, that have not been shoved around, had their land 'stolen', been enslaved and abused.  Those same folks have in their turn, been the land stealers,  the abusers, the slavers. 
There is no way to sift back through time and change history.  If one group is guilty and needs to 'pay restitution', then we all need to.   My Irish great grandparents were treated as badly by the British as the indians were.   Land stolen, enslaved, killed in their millions.  No one is expecting the English to pay restitution now.
I still support Columbus Day.   We would not be having this conversation now if he had not sailed over.

(the myth of the poor red man is over hyped.   They were no more noble than any other group.  They were focused on rape, pillage, theft and slavery like all other primitive people.  Never even invented the wheel.  )

OK, reasoned, calm discussion of misplaced emotion you say. well, If it's not angry, it would appear to use inflammatory language.

Then you go on to say "You cannot find a single group of folks living anywhere, that have not been shoved around, had their land 'stolen', been enslaved and abused.  Those same folks have in their turn, been the land stealers,  the abusers, the slavers."

You used the Irish as an example. I am not a student of history but since my namesake is my X2 grandfather, born in County Cork, Ireland, 1820, I would think I would have heard something somewhere about the Irish being "abusers, slavers and land stealers". I know the Irish were the recipients of such treatment, but I don't recall they ever delt out such treatment to others. Maybe you could enlighten me on that.
   I'm not sure the Irish forming political parties and taking charge of the NYC Police Dept., as part of that political movement, qualifies.
   And Lastly, "misplaced emotion"  Aaah, whose? and where? A friendly reminder to use "Indigenous People Day" as an excuse to enjoy the outdoors would hardly seem the appropriate time to remind everyone that the "Red man" was nothing special. If I read between the lines, and that's always a hazardous endeavour, you are of the opinion that anyone not a WASP is nothing special. Am I correct in that?

[Pete Bog]

 Really,  this country and the rest of the world for that matter is under siege by a radical entity bent on "the big reset", new world order, one world government, using racism, economic class division, and destroying the world's economy,  their goal is to rebuild with a ruling class and a slave/peasant worker class dependent on the ruling government (aka the masters),  and you are so ignorant that you ask such a foolish question while speaking down your nose at those members who dare post the truth and resist the yoke placed at their feet.
 IMHO it's you who is soul less and should be begging of their sympathy toward you.

Oh, they exist alright, you just can't see them because your ignorance keeps getting in your way,  they are being brought into the light your're just so blinded by small mindedness that you refuse to look, not that long ago this country was recovering from our first black communist president,  the economy was doing great, unemployment was low,  minorities were enjoying opportunities they never had, manufacturing was coming back, taxes were resonable, for the first time in decades we were energy independent,  and the rest of the world was if not totally peaceful, it was at least orderly,  and some long fighting enemies were forming friendly relations and alliances,  inflation was held in a normal function and income for all was increasing.
 Then came the coup through trickery, deceit, thievery,  and the wide spread corruption of the media and big tech, the perfect storm, take a real look around today, nothing is going right,  our freedoms, our institutions, our economy, all are being assaulted, and if we complain we risk loosing all we have, some have been imprisoned for speaking out,  oh, yes, they exist alright, and you two are card carrying members of THEM,  how's that for dragging them out into the bright light of day.
 Take the last word if you want it, but I'm done with your Bull $chitt for now.  ^'^   
[/quote]

And once again, an Ad Hominem. When a debater runs out of rational arguments and reverts to personal attacks, his side of the debate is lost.
What's this now? Pete 3, Moe 0?

You keep saying your going to put me on ignore and you're done with my Bull $chitt. But you keep injecting inflammatory remarks where none are warranted. wsdstan said he was going to put me on ignore and he's been a man of his word.  Good on him, not so much on you.

I can deliver ad hominem too. It would appear that you were born Tabula Rasa, (stoic epistemology) and still have it!

Sorry Moe, I'm just having too much fun. Don't take it so seriously, we all know your "GRUMPY". I'd feel bad if you "popped a cork" on my account.

[Mannlicher]

Pete,  I still don't see your point here, if there is one.  And you are right about not being a student of history.

[Pete Bog]

Aaaand so, the discussion dies. You don't want to enlightenment me on the Irish being "abusers, slavers and land stealers"? Very well. I didn't think they were.