Blades and Bushlore

Bushlore Topics => Bushlore and Outdoor Skills => Wilderness Survival => Topic started by: WI_Woodsman on September 15, 2013, 10:16:43 PM

Title: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 15, 2013, 10:16:43 PM
I know that each scenario dictates a different priority but what I'm getting at is, in a situation where you were hundreds of miles from civilization and you had nothing but the cloths on your back and the knowledge in your head; What would be the highest priority to effect you survival?

Or, what's the first "project" you would commit calories, hydration and brain power to in order to effect survival?

I've never been in a survival situation (and hope never to be) so I'm looking forward to seeing your responses...   :)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Old Philosopher on September 15, 2013, 11:15:55 PM
...What would be the highest priority to effect you survival?

Or, what's the first "project" you would commit calories, hydration and brain power to in order to effect survival?...
Finding a water source, and then the means to make it safe to drink.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: PetrifiedWood on September 15, 2013, 11:40:57 PM
I think it's a toss up between water and shelter, with a bias toward water. In almost every situation, if you need shelter first, it means your clothing isn't adequate for the conditions. But there are rare cases where the weather is unseasonably hot, cold, or windy that aren't easily anticipated. Then perhaps shelter might take priority over water.

It really depends on the conditions and the circumstances surrounding the situation as far as what projects one might need to undertake first. For example in a snowy winter situation, shelter and fire might come first, because you will need fire to make water when it's all frozen. But since you have a relatively abundant source (the snow) you wouldn't need to go to great lengths to find it.

 In a hot desert situation, you might need to decide if searching for an elusive and possibly non-existent water source is a better expenditure of limited resources than staying put and sheltering from the sun while signalling for help with a fire or other means.

The middle of the ocean with no boat means no fire, no shelter and no drinkable water. :shrug:

There really is no one priority that can work for every situation, unless it is to plan ahead before a survival situation happens, and decide beforehand what your priorities will need to be for the likely survival scenarios given your location and time of year.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Old Philosopher on September 16, 2013, 12:03:51 AM
...
There really is no one priority that can work for every situation, unless it is to plan ahead before a survival situation happens, and decide beforehand what your priorities will need to be for the likely survival scenarios given your location and time of year.
That pretty much sums it up. These conversations always seem to get overly specific and scenario oriented before too many posts.
Other than finding yourself buck naked in a blizzard, or under the topical sun, what's the greatest threat to life? Dehydration. Okay...I'm in a blizzard. Water problem solved itself...now for some shelter from the elements.
Personally, I think it's a tossup as to which is going to degrade your survival chances faster: dehydration, or hypothermia. Both lead to loss of mental acuity, and motor skills. The ability to hydrate safely depends upon being able to sanitize your water source, so fire is an integral part of the equation, not only for hydration, but to prevent hypothermia.
I agree with PW that the situation dictates priorities, but over a 72+ hour period, I don't know that it's possible to say one is always more important than the other...unless it's water. You can be warm and out of the elements in a shelter, but you still can't go without water for very long.

Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: mac on September 16, 2013, 12:06:56 AM
really depends on the location and the season.
Canadian winters would require shelter to be a high priority, however building a shelter would be difficult without drinking water.
Fire would also be of great importance for warmth as well as purifying water.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: xj35s on September 16, 2013, 06:31:13 AM
Part of any survival situation is knowing what to do.

 For an example, do you know what to do if your in a flash mob and people are getting knocked down and trampled to death? You cross your arms in front of your chest and push out. lift your legs and "float" with the mob until it disperses.

The Military and other manuals state it best. 3 hours without shelter, 3 day's without water, and 3 weeks without food.

Even in the desert when you think the heat and sun are so dangerous you have to find water, you're wrong. Shelter should still be number one. what you are forgetting is that the nights dip down very low.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 16, 2013, 06:35:44 AM
I suppose I would go with fire...  Provides warmth, boost moral, wards off potential predators, hardens clay pots (which can hold water), coals burn out wooden bowls (which can also hold water), and can be used as a rescue signal.  I know that this isn't universal priority but if I were caught out in the boreal forest I'd have to say fire would be my highest priority... 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on September 16, 2013, 07:27:48 AM
I'm going to vote with xj35s & Cody Lundin on this one :P
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Wilderbeast on September 16, 2013, 08:20:43 AM
My highest priority is to stay out of survival situations.

An ounce of prevention...

Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on September 16, 2013, 08:48:34 AM
LOL WB.

In FL, most of the year it would be water.  However,  you can't get hundreds of miles from civilization down here.  There are many places that you may not see another human being for awhile.  We work at finding them.   ;)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: DomC on September 16, 2013, 09:17:16 AM
Fire, water, shelter in that order. Florida is at sea level or below so water is abundant dig a few feet you can usually hit water near a swamp, pond, or lake, but you still need to purify it so knowing how to start a fire is top priority in my book. But true survival is dependent on proper mindset of the individual and their physical capabilities/fitness.

DomC :) ;)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Old Philosopher on September 16, 2013, 09:25:29 AM
Part of any survival situation is knowing what to do.
.....
The Military and other manuals state it best. 3 hours without shelter, 3 day's without water, and 3 weeks without food.

Even in the desert when you think the heat and sun are so dangerous you have to find water, you're wrong. Shelter should still be number one. what you are forgetting is that the nights dip down very low.
While the Rule of Threes has a sound basis, I question the 3 hours without shelter part, unless you count adequate clothing as 'shelter'. And out in the desert sun, even the shade of a mesquite bush could be considered 'shelter' in that situation. If you're caught in a rain storm in the rainforests of the PNW, you put on your poncho, or go stand under a tree. You've just found 'shelter' in a sense.
So back to what PW said about every situation can change your immediate priorities.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: hunter63 on September 16, 2013, 12:41:23 PM
IMO....You need to keep core heat/cool in balance or all other aspects are irrelevant ......so,

Shelter/fire.....this can go either way......
Fire/shelter
Water
Food
Rule of threes does apply........
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 16, 2013, 06:12:56 PM
I agree knowledge is priority that is why this thread was started...   ;)

I also agree every situation may dictates different priorities and there is no one single priority than should be mandated in every situation.  I guess I was hoping by not defining the wilderness survival situation that people would insert it themselves (considering B&B members are found in every climate and terrain in the world).   ;D
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WoodsWoman on September 16, 2013, 08:34:00 PM
I think for me it would be fire.   The comfort, the warmth, water purification and I can get it smokey enough for bug control.   Mosquitoes can drive a man/woman insane ...

WW.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 17, 2013, 06:18:45 AM
I think for me it would be fire.   The comfort, the warmth, water purification and I can get it smokey enough for bug control.   Mosquitoes can drive a man/woman insane ...

WW.

Yeah, I forgot to mention mosquito control...  Fire's got a lot of benefits!   :D
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: PetrifiedWood on September 17, 2013, 09:31:26 AM
I still believe that if you need supplemental shelter to survive, then you aren't dressed properly for the conditions in the first place. Shelter is a band aid fix for inadequate clothing in most (not all) circumstances. Clothing should be selected for temperature and climate extremes for the area, not how it feels at 2:00 in the afternoon. You should be packing enough extra layers to ensure comfort in case of cold and wet conditions. If you have adequate clothing, you can spend a night out without building shelter.

Since shelter construction isn't always possible, having the right clothes is important. You wouldn't go on a hike without shoes. Why go without extra layers?

Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: kanukkarhu on September 17, 2013, 11:04:53 AM
Can I play?

In winter around here (and I'm sure lots of places on the continent) it might not be realistic to be able to carry enough clothing to survive, outside of a lot of specialized gear. I don't know if I own clothes that could allow me to stay the night exposed during one of our colder winter nights. I know I wouldn't want to try it... When the animals aren't moving and the tree branches are snapping like rifle shots, I'd hate to have only the clothes on my back (or in my backpack for that matter)... But if you have the stuff to stay out without a fire or shelter, is that really a "survival" situation, or just a 'forced camp out'? I dunno... (unless you've other 'survival' concerns.) i think there are times of the year when being outside with only what you are wearing is sketchy - unless you've got equipment and a shelter OR shelter and a fire. Thats why i think most peope i know would opt for some kind of a shelter and a fire asap. Again, just my opinion.

As far as the original question, I think if I was ever in a true survival situation, I would personally assess my current need to stay healthy. It might vary from climate to climate and circumstance to circumstance, but the first thing in my book is to take a look at the immediate and first threat to my safety/life. I'd get that threat neutralized and move on o the next upcoming one. That way, you're adapting to the situation and not wasting calories doing what you think you need, but might not really need.

Again, just my $.02.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WoodsWoman on September 17, 2013, 11:42:51 AM
KK I want to jump in here and add another thought to your 'winter survival' thought.   Don't forget that for us we can use the snow to our advantage for shelter.   Getting out of the wind would be my first priority if in that situation and I'm poorly dressed.   

There's been a lot of survivors over many years that have survived just by burrowing down into the snow over night.

So for me, those first calories burned in winter would be shelter..and then fire near the shelter.  :)   Snow is my water so that would be one less worry. 

WW.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on September 17, 2013, 04:36:39 PM
I was able to get a 'loaner' copy of Cody Lundin's book on this very subject & I tend to agree with WW, KK and him when it comes to keeping that core-temperature at 98.6, so I recommend reading his thoughts on the matter......it's well done, if not a bit 'quirky' ;)



http://www.amazon.com/98-6-Degrees-Keeping-Your-Alive/dp/1586852345
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Draco on September 17, 2013, 04:38:27 PM
I think, as others have said, it all depends.  Probably in the desert water could be considered most important.  In cold and snow shelter rises to the top.  What is going to kill you first?  That is what you need to solve.

I also found Cody's book very good but if people are offended by bawdy humor then you might want to pass. 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: kanukkarhu on September 17, 2013, 09:05:51 PM
I think, as others have said, it all depends.  Probably in the desert water could be considered most important.  In cold and snow shelter rises to the top.  What is going to kill you first?  That is what you need to solve.

I also found Cody's book very good but if people are offended by bawdy humor then you might want to pass.
I totally agree with that^ especially the bit which I've emphasised.  I might find myself in a true survival situation with one of the main things already taken care of (say for example, stranded in a vehicle), so I'd then move on to the next potential threat to my life, and so on.  I think when people suffer the most is often because they've not properly prioritized their dilemma.  It's always the one thing that you didn't see coming that gets you, isn't it?

I'm offended by Cody's book because he said he'd eat me... sorta... indirectly, kinda... ;)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: kanukkarhu on September 17, 2013, 09:15:59 PM
KK I want to jump in here and add another thought to your 'winter survival' thought.   Don't forget that for us we can use the snow to our advantage for shelter.   Getting out of the wind would be my first priority if in that situation and I'm poorly dressed.   

There's been a lot of survivors over many years that have survived just by burrowing down into the snow over night.

So for me, those first calories burned in winter would be shelter..and then fire near the shelter.  :)   Snow is my water so that would be one less worry. 

WW.
  Amen sista! :) A quinsy (sp?) or good snowtrench could save your life in the coldest nights without a sleeping bag... I guess.  But you know from where you live how cold it can get out there at night...  Imagine being out there in a snow cave with no fire... Here's hoping no one here ever needs to find that out.  :-\

I dunno, though, I just have a hard time picturing me coming home after a night in the dead of winter without both a fire AND shelter... (or like I said, a sleeping system and shelter).  In real cold weather I think I'm first out of the wind, IMMEDIATELY followed by building a fire, third snugging up my shelter all the while making drastic life-altering deals with God... ;) 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Saintnick001 on September 18, 2013, 09:20:11 AM
Down here I'm going to say water first. TP comes in at a close second.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on September 18, 2013, 09:29:05 AM
[quote ...all the while making drastic life-altering deals with God... ;)
[/quote]

oh my.  How many times have I been there.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: kanukkarhu on September 18, 2013, 03:34:50 PM
[quote ...all the while making drastic life-altering deals with God... ;)

oh my.  How many times have I been there.
[/quote]I know, eh? :)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: MATT CHAOS on September 19, 2013, 06:05:32 AM
I have been thinking on this.  I think your body will dictate what you need to do in any given survival situation.  If you are cold, it will tell you that you need shelter and fire.  If you are hungry and thirsty, it will tell you that you need food and water.  If are hot, it will tell you to find some way to cool off.
Now just because your body is telling you things DOES NOT MEAN you are listening to your body.  Obviously, you need to know your body and "listen" to it.

I know this is not exactly the answer that was probably anticipated but I think if you listen to your body (any time) (and have a good head on your shoulders especially how to cope in the outdoors) things should work out and you should be able to pull through any situation.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: abo4ster on September 21, 2013, 06:30:57 PM
I wrote about this recently on my blog as it relates to the Secrets of Survival TV show with Les Stroud and a book of a similar name that has a specific plan of wilderness survival priorities starting with Fire right after First Aid.  I have spoken with several full-time survival instructors about "priorities" and even specifically about this book which calls out a specific plan.  Bottom-line is being able to adapt.

However, in cold weather, reducing heat loss is very likely going to be your number one strategy.  Most relate this to shelter, but reducing heat loss maybe something as simple as removing wet clothes, getting off the ground, getting out of the wind, and/or changing elevation.  After that, FIRE.

Quote
NEXT TO KNOWING HOW TO DRESS WELL, FIRE IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT BUSH SKILLS THERE ARE, BECAUSE IT IS ONE OF THE FEW MEANS AVAILABLE TO MAKE UP MOST GREAT DEFICIENCIES.  -- Mors Kochanski

You can state the priorities many different ways...

Rule of 3's (w/fire)

OR

Quote
The essence of survival is to be able to sleep comfortably when you need to and to drink enough water to maintain the bodily functions at an optimum level. Outside of life threatening injury, an immediate concern is maintaining a comfortable body temperature. In cold conditions this is accomplished by dressing adequately, knowing how to preserve or maintain the insulative integrity of your clothing and supplementing any inadequacy with fire and shelter.  -- Mors Kochanski, Basic Safe Travel and Boreal Survival Handbook from Karamat Wilderness Ways.

OR

Quote
If it's COLD outside
- Reduce heat loss: get out of the wind, off the ground, and remove wet clothing.
- Put on dry, insulated clothing and seek or make shelter. Pay special attention to protecting your head, neck, and torso.
- Build a fire if necessary. Gather extra wood for the night.
- Drink your water (hot if possible with a few dissolved hard candies or sugar). Clear urine means your body has enough water.
- Eat high-energy foods (carbs) throughout the day.
- Get familiar with your area and make camp early before it gets dark.
- Rest and conserve your energy unless you are performing vital tasks or exercising to keep warm.
- Maintain a calm, positive attitude.
- Be prepared to signal rescuers at all times.
-- Cody Lundin, 98.6 Degrees, The Art of Keeping Your Ass Alive

Personally, I like the way Lundin outlines the Cold-Weather Bottom-Line, which can be found on Page 75 of his book in detail.  Again, these are the bottom-line considerations, NOT priorities.  I simplified them here...

COLD-WEATHER BOTTOM LINE
1. Produce Heat - only 3 ways; food, exercise, and fire.
2. Decrease Heat Loss - understand the five heat-loss mechanisms.
3. Avoid becoming exhausted (60 percent rule). Working at 60 percent allows the body to burn fat reserves instead of using up glucose and oxygen stores. Get adequate sleep and rest.
4. Reduce internal and external constriction -  Avoid ingesting vasoconstricting substances; tight clothing, equipment, and footwear.
5. Stay Hydrated - Drink warm to hot liquids if possible; urine should appear ?clear.?
6. Stay aware of what's happening.  Be conservative. 

Understanding the Cold-Weather Bottom-Line before you "go out" is the best preparation in my opinion.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on September 21, 2013, 06:44:05 PM
I think somebody mentioned locality before.  When it's 100 degrees and 100 percent humidity, you won't stay dry and won't get cold.  Good luck getting a friction fire going.

Chris knows this.  He doesn't even wear shoes. Doesn't use a headlamp either. LOL.  My kinda guy. :)

Down south a lot of the year it's all about making water safe to drink...or just getting to it.  I HAVE gone for many days on just water down here.
 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: PetrifiedWood on September 21, 2013, 07:05:46 PM
Interesting that Mors puts clothing right at the top.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on September 21, 2013, 07:12:07 PM
Interesting that Mors puts clothing right at the top.

hmmm. a naked pot and machete...

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

Putting this in perspective... My little brother ran off into the northern MN woods in a pair of Speedos and an stocking cap after Mom cut his hair.  He was 8.  It was the late 60's or early 70's.  He was such a little bastard we didn't go looking for him.  He came back 3 days later with about 1000 skeeter bites.  Meaner than ever.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: ncnurseryman on September 21, 2013, 08:14:06 PM
I'm going to say shelter for protection against the elements and a feeling of security at night.  Water would be a very close second but here's a question.  if you were faced with a survival situation and had nothing to start a fire with and was unable to start a friction fire, would you drink untreated water in the hopes that you would be rescued soon.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: ncnurseryman on September 21, 2013, 08:18:11 PM
I would if I became severely dehydrated, I don't know if you would have a viable choice.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: abo4ster on September 21, 2013, 10:19:58 PM
Interesting that Mors puts clothing right at the top.

= reducing heat loss (shelter)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 22, 2013, 08:12:25 AM
Cody's book has been mentioned quite a bit in this thread I'm going to have to pick up a copy!

A lot of people have been saying build a shelter especially if you don't have proper clothing for the climate.  I agree that a shelter is high on the list of priorities the problem is that most people find themselves in a survival situation late in the day which doesn't give you a lot of day light to build an adequate shelter to provide for your needs.

Although most shelter building requires a lot of time and calories so I suppose it would be prudent to use 'em while you have 'em...

Mad Max, you had mentioned that in Florida potable water is the highest priority, in a wilderness survival situation how would you purify water without fire?   
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Alaskan Bushman on September 22, 2013, 09:28:13 AM
There is no one answer, different regions have different priority's and people are going to have there own opinions.
I can tell you for me, were I live without a doubt, fire is priority #1

Now, there are always exceptions to the rule.
If I were to get caught out above timberline up on a pass and there was no fuel for priority #1 then I would be looking for a natural wind block and hunker down.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Draco on September 22, 2013, 09:37:53 AM
Cody's book has been mentioned quite a bit in this thread I'm going to have to pick up a copy!

I think you will enjoy it.  Cody gets slammed a lot for his hippie attitude but I think if you read his book you will see that is totally unfounded.  Sure he has that look but there is no entitlement attitude in his writing and he specifically says that you are responsible for your own survival.  I totally agree with his survival philosophy.  It is not man vs. mother nature.  Mother nature does not care a bit about you.  It simply is what it is and you have to be able to adapt to what you need to survive. 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on September 22, 2013, 09:54:57 AM


Mad Max, you had mentioned that in Florida potable water is the highest priority, in a wilderness survival situation how would you purify water without fire?   

Central FL has a great many fresh water springs.  We just had this conversation at a swamp camp.  If I couldn't purify water I'ld paddle or swim to the middle of the lake or river and collect water there.

You supposedly can also purify water by scavenging a plastic bottle and using sunlight.  I'm still on the fence on this one.  I'ld do the swim before the bottle.

Disclaimer.  If it's Feb, in the 40's, and raining here...whole 'nother ball game.  Hypothermia will incapacitate you very quickly even down here.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: ncnurseryman on September 22, 2013, 10:52:06 AM
Max, what's the reason for going to the middle of a lake or river?  Why would the water be more pure there on a microscopic level verses any where else?
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on September 22, 2013, 11:21:25 AM
Max, what's the reason for going to the middle of a lake or river?  Why would the water be more pure there on a microscopic level verses any where else?

This is more my beliefs than science.  I think in shallow water the microbes and that nasty amoeba feed on the stuff that gets stirred up from the bottom.  That's why the kids get the amoeba mostly down here. They thrash around in the shallow water and stir up a MUCH larger concentration of bad things than and adult who swims out to deeper water.  It's about the concentration of the little boogers.  :shrug:

I always boil, filter or treat water unless I'm at the source.  I've had giardia and my brother was very sick for months after getting crypto on Kauai (from swimming).  These are NOT something you want to deal with.  But dehydration is frickin' horrible.  And most people get out of the "survival" situation within three days.

Just FYI. I was shown to take water from the middle of the lake in the Boundary Waters as a kid, not FL.  Both local folks believe the same. 

Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: abo4ster on September 22, 2013, 12:25:34 PM

A lot of people have been saying build a shelter especially if you don't have proper clothing for the climate.  I agree that a shelter is high on the list of priorities the problem is that most people find themselves in a survival situation late in the day which doesn't give you a lot of day light to build an adequate shelter to provide for your needs.

Although most shelter building requires a lot of time and calories so I suppose it would be prudent to use 'em while you have 'em...

That's why I always carry a couple trash bags in my kit.  So many ways to reduce heat loss...  You can use it as a shelter, poncho, insulated jacket, mattress, duvet, and more... (http://masterwoodsman.com/2013/trash-bag-guide-to-survival/)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on September 22, 2013, 12:56:49 PM

A lot of people have been saying build a shelter especially if you don't have proper clothing for the climate.  I agree that a shelter is high on the list of priorities the problem is that most people find themselves in a survival situation late in the day which doesn't give you a lot of day light to build an adequate shelter to provide for your needs.

Although most shelter building requires a lot of time and calories so I suppose it would be prudent to use 'em while you have 'em...

That's why I always carry a couple trash bags in my kit.  So many ways to reduce heat loss...  You can use it as a shelter, poncho, insulated jacket, mattress, duvet, and more... (http://masterwoodsman.com/2013/trash-bag-guide-to-survival/)
Great post!  I agree with you completely on the necessity of reducing or maintaining heat loss and its importance in staying alive.  The garbage bags are about the easiest and best simple solution to a lot of VERY important measures in keeping that core temperature at 98.6......heat or cold can kill you fast if you aren't prepared to deal with it!   I don't know of anyone in my immediate area that has succumbed due to dehydration, but it is more common than one might think to perish from exposure here!  It happens every year, mainly to kids and older people that get stranded in their cars in very cold or very hot conditions.  Those garbage bags (and knowing how to utilize them) could save your bacon in a severe and extreme temperature or weather condition!
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: abo4ster on September 22, 2013, 06:30:58 PM
Thanks Wolfy.

Good feedback Tony.  Good water can be a tough proposition sometimes in Florida -- no doubt!
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Moe M. on September 23, 2013, 08:20:58 AM

  Personally I like to stick with the KISS theory,  for me it's Core temp., hydration, and food,  so the first on my priority list is maintaining core temp by having the right clothing,  then some sort of shelter and a fire.
  Second is a water source and a way to make it safe to drink,  again, that's where the fire plays such an important role.
  Since I can go more than a few days without food before weakness sets in in a survival situation I need to do those things that take dexterity and energy first.

  Where we are is key,  trying to come up with a "what's more important" list for every situation is not practical since someone stranded in the desert is going to have very different basic needs than someone stuck in the woods of northern Maine in winter.
  That's why it's so critical to be prepared with a general knowledge of the area you'll be in and a have  a basic survival kit that will allow those needs to be met.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Trekster on September 23, 2013, 09:04:03 PM
Water, or shelter depending on your situation.

In most temperate climates (even on cold nights) chances are you'll dehydrate before you die of hypothermia as long as you're dressed properly for the occasion. Maybe even if you're not as long as you have enough body fat on you haha.

PMZ
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 24, 2013, 07:56:03 AM
I've heard of exposing water (in a plastic bottle to) sunlight as a means of purifying water but I share your skepticism Max, Cryptosporidium and Giardia are nothing to mess around with especially in a survival situation.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: MnSportsman on September 24, 2013, 08:48:16 AM
This is an interesting topic.

:)


Lots of things to think on...
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Draco on September 24, 2013, 02:28:33 PM
Good post NmSportsman.  I have always assumed that chlorine dioxide would kill just about anything and that regular chlorine was just as effective.  A closer look from the CDC website is also a interesting read and gives much better detail as to what kills what.

http://www.cdc.gov/healthywater/drinking/travel/backcountry_water_treatment.html (http://www.cdc.gov/healthywater/drinking/travel/backcountry_water_treatment.html)

I would say that all the survival experts who told us just to use chlorine are not seeing the CDC results.  I still feel pretty good about my AquaMira drops but boiling or filtering is more effective. 

Great one page pdf from CDC
http://www.cdc.gov/healthywater/pdf/drinking/Backcountry_Water_Treatment.pdf (http://www.cdc.gov/healthywater/pdf/drinking/Backcountry_Water_Treatment.pdf)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: abo4ster on September 24, 2013, 07:20:42 PM
Symptoms for Giardia take 1 to 3 weeks to show up.

Symptoms for the more rare Cyptospridium cyst can be as soon as 2 days, but average is about a week.

Average survival scenario is less than 72 hours.  If I can't treat my water, I'll play the odds, drink the water, and get treatment for bad water after rescue (if necessary).  No reason to suffer dehydration and the associated effects which lead to diminished physical performance and mental capacity which ultimately contribute one's demise via hypothermia.

---------------------

SODIS (http://www.sodis.ch/index_EN) is the UV method.  It's popularity started with third world countries.

---------------------

FWIW, I like micro pur tabs, which are chlorine dioxide.  The CDC gives it a rough time because the contact time is high to address crypto if the water is really cold.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 24, 2013, 07:38:10 PM

FWIW, I like micro pur tabs, which are chlorine dioxide.  The CDC gives it a rough time because the contact time is high to address crypto if the water is really cold.

Thanks for the info Chris, I have only use iodine tablets once, I'll have to give the micro pur tabs a try... 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Draco on September 24, 2013, 07:54:38 PM

FWIW, I like micro pur tabs, which are chlorine dioxide.  The CDC gives it a rough time because the contact time is high to address crypto if the water is really cold.

Thanks for the info Chris, I have only use iodine tablets once, I'll have to give the micro pur tabs a try...

I know Cody and some others recommend iodine.  All I can say is YUCK.   :P  I don't get why anyone would pick that over chlorine dioxide.  I think the chlorine dioxide actually improves the flavor of some bad water.  I have always used the AquaMira drops or tabs. 

After reading this thread I think I will get one of the new Sawyer Mini filters.  They are cheaper than a replacement filter for my Hiker Pro and are a fraction of the weight. 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 24, 2013, 08:26:21 PM
One of my buddies has a devise that emits a powerful ultraviolet light it's called a SteriPEN he swears by it...  I hate to sound like an old curmudgeon stuck in my ways but I don't trust it to eradicate the microscopic nasties.  I prefer to filter (if it needs it) then bring it to a boil!

The only reason I use my iodine tablets is because I was hiking in the Himalayas and we didn't have time to stop and boil water, I was told the source was "clean" but I wasn't taking any chances...  Yeah I agree with ya Draco, iodine isn't my favorite taste but it taste better than bile...   :puke: 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Trekster on September 24, 2013, 08:35:51 PM
I may be considered weird for saying this, but when I'm hiking hard, or outside working, I'm thirsty. I don't give a rat's ass what the water tastes like, as long as it's potable. Therefore I will consider almost any method of purification, whether filtering, chemical, or boiling.

When you're really thirsty you won't care if it tastes like iodine, or chlorinated flouridated city water, or whatever.

PMZ
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: MnSportsman on September 24, 2013, 08:43:11 PM
Good topic about the Priorities of a Wilderness Survival Situation.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Draco on September 24, 2013, 08:44:26 PM
WI Yes iodine is better than bile.  :lol:  I never got into the SteriPEN idea either.  Batteries and a fairly complicated technique.  Questionable effectiveness in cloudy water. 

I just ordered one of the new Sawyer Mini's.  For $25 and better than EPA standards you really can't go wrong. 

Trekster, I agree that I have been thirsty enough that swamp water was great but I still prefer a sweet tasting spring fed creek over nasty larva infested swamp any day. 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: abo4ster on September 24, 2013, 09:25:58 PM

FWIW, I like micro pur tabs, which are chlorine dioxide.  The CDC gives it a rough time because the contact time is high to address crypto if the water is really cold.

Thanks for the info Chris, I have only use iodine tablets once, I'll have to give the micro pur tabs a try...

No problem, check out the photo on the micro pur tabs in this article I wrote: http://masterwoodsman.com/2013/collecting-treating-backcountry-water/
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Trekster on September 24, 2013, 09:27:53 PM
Well of course, spring water is better. No doubt about it :)

On a related note, have any of you guys ever run out of water on a hike or hunt and had to drink water from a creek or spring without purifying it?

I have. I never got sick (thankfully) but it worried me haha.

PMZ
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: abo4ster on September 24, 2013, 09:33:00 PM

FWIW, I like micro pur tabs, which are chlorine dioxide.  The CDC gives it a rough time because the contact time is high to address crypto if the water is really cold.

Thanks for the info Chris, I have only use iodine tablets once, I'll have to give the micro pur tabs a try...

I know Cody and some others recommend iodine.  All I can say is YUCK.   :P  I don't get why anyone would pick that over chlorine dioxide.  I think the chlorine dioxide actually improves the flavor of some bad water.  I have always used the AquaMira drops or tabs. 

After reading this thread I think I will get one of the new Sawyer Mini filters.  They are cheaper than a replacement filter for my Hiker Pro and are a fraction of the weight.

I agree 100% on the iodine taste.  It is the lost cost alternative if you are staying out for several days.  And it is multi-use.  I have used it out west where fire wasn't an option in the summer.  Problem is you don't want to drink as frequently.  And your plastic bottle will forever smell and taste of iodine.

Back east, boiling is my long-term treatment for water.  Micro pur tabs are perfect for a dayhike and I also agree on improving taste if there is any organic matter.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 24, 2013, 09:35:58 PM

FWIW, I like micro pur tabs, which are chlorine dioxide.  The CDC gives it a rough time because the contact time is high to address crypto if the water is really cold.

Thanks for the info Chris, I have only use iodine tablets once, I'll have to give the micro pur tabs a try...

No problem, check out the photo on the micro pur tabs in this article I wrote: http://masterwoodsman.com/2013/collecting-treating-backcountry-water/

I think the link is broken...  I can't get to the site.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on September 24, 2013, 09:58:56 PM
Well of course, spring water is better. No doubt about it :)

On a related note, have any of you guys ever run out of water on a hike or hunt and had to drink water from a creek or spring without purifying it?

I have. I never got sick (thankfully) but it worried me haha.

PMZ
I've mentioned in other threads that springs are the only ground water source around here that I will drink from without treatment.  I know where several are located & note them on my maps when I discover one for possible future use.  Some of them are sporadic & you can't always depend on them flowing or 'trickling', which may be a better term, in all seasons or years.  Some are no more than 'seeps' where you have to dig a collecting pocket before there's enough to actually use.  The problem with 'seeps' is finding the actual source.  It's usually soggy, muddy and full of deer and 'coon tracks because they appreciate a cool drink as much as we do......that can be a big problem for obvious reasons.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Trekster on September 24, 2013, 11:47:14 PM
Well of course, spring water is better. No doubt about it :)

On a related note, have any of you guys ever run out of water on a hike or hunt and had to drink water from a creek or spring without purifying it?

I have. I never got sick (thankfully) but it worried me haha.

PMZ
I've mentioned in other threads that springs are the only ground water source around here that I will drink from without treatment.  I know where several are located & note them on my maps when I discover one for possible future use.  Some of them are sporadic & you can't always depend on them flowing or 'trickling', which may be a better term, in all seasons or years.  Some are no more than 'seeps' where you have to dig a collecting pocket before there's enough to actually use.  The problem with 'seeps' is finding the actual source.  It's usually soggy, muddy and full of deer and 'coon tracks because they appreciate a cool drink as much as we do......that can be a big problem for obvious reasons.


Wolfy, yeah, even around here where it's a little wetter, there are times when the springs (especially on the mountain (Blue Ridge, where the AT runs along) dry up and then you're up (http://bladesandbushcraft.com/Smileys/krystl-white/censored.gif) creek without a friggin' paddle haha. I pity those poor thru hikers haha. Other people do too, and even go so far as to haul milk jugs full of tap water up to the parking lots on hot days during the summer for them to fill their bottles and bladders from.

I mentioned streams because to my mind some streams are cleaner than others. We don't have many beaver around my area, they're more of a northern PA through Canada thing, although some places have runoff from homes, farms (pesticides and herbicides) and even industry pollutes some rivers at least. I'd never drink river or lake water around here without purifying it or boiling the hell out of it lmao. Bad news. Same for quarries and ponds/swamps. Some jackweed pulled in after dark a couple of years ago with his R.V. and dumped a metric (http://bladesandbushcraft.com/Smileys/krystl-white/censored.gif) ton of sewage (no pun intended) into one of my Grandpa's quarries. Turned all murky green for a while and though the nasty color is gone I still wouldn't drink from it or even eat fish caught in it cause this other idiot neighbor (church friend with high moral standards [which count for nothing cause he's a sport poacher]) dumps deer hides stuffed in feed sacks into it every hunting season.

PMZ
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on September 25, 2013, 02:48:53 AM
Well of course, spring water is better. No doubt about it :)

On a related note, have any of you guys ever run out of water on a hike or hunt and had to drink water from a creek or spring without purifying it?

I have. I never got sick (thankfully) but it worried me haha.

PMZ

Yup.  And gotten away with it.  Until... :(
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: abo4ster on September 25, 2013, 06:24:20 AM

FWIW, I like micro pur tabs, which are chlorine dioxide.  The CDC gives it a rough time because the contact time is high to address crypto if the water is really cold.

Thanks for the info Chris, I have only use iodine tablets once, I'll have to give the micro pur tabs a try...

No problem, check out the photo on the micro pur tabs in this article I wrote: http://masterwoodsman.com/2013/collecting-treating-backcountry-water/

I think the link is broken...  I can't get to the site.

Try again, it's up now.   :)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Yeoman on September 26, 2013, 12:15:28 PM
For me, the highest priority is calming down. The first task I expend calories on is finding a dry place to sit down.

Here's a detailed (long) explanation:
Last year while preparing to instruct survival training for my SAR team, I was pondering many, many different ways to explain how to prioritize what to do when you are required to spend a night or two outside unexpectedly. I've come to prefer this term to "emergency" or "survival situation" or "lost"  ;)
I read through many sources and watched many videos and spoke with many members of my SAR team and reflected back on my own experiences. What it came down to is that the rule of threes was missing a "3":
Commonly we hear: 3 minutes without air, 3 hours without shelter, 3 days without water.
What I thought of though is what we teach in the Hug-a-Tree program for lost-proofing children: "find a tree and hug it." The first thing to do is calm down, don't panic. Therefore the missing rule of threes is:
3 seconds without thinking.
I now start with this. I find I spend as much time on psychology and practical ways to stop panic as I do on "skills".

As to the debate on fire vs shelter: If it is windy and/or rainy shelter first. If it's neither or getting near dark, fire.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: MnSportsman on September 26, 2013, 06:10:53 PM
Only because I do not remember it being mentioned...


   Fire as a priority might be an important one to consider since, not only does it provide warmth & some protection, but the smoke & smell might help signal those who are searching for you...   "If"  they are searching...even within a "72 hour period". Heck, you might be rescued in less than 24 hrs if they see the smoke, or smell it and are looking for ya... You make the right signal of three in a triangle, or a straight line & someone might get ya out in 12 hours or less.. Who knows... Fire might be a good one to put up there in the "priorities" list.


BTW... I think the, " most folks are rescued in 72 hours", is a bit of a "skew" on averages. I think that if you are in a crappy situation, if you don't have a handle on what to do, & what to prioritize to make your survival odds better... You are a "medivac", or not likely to remain among the living.


Additionally... I'm thinking that if you don't know enough to at least dig a hole about a foot or so from a "moving" water source, & let the seep help filter the water, rather than just drinking directly from a unknown/unproven moving water source like a stream/creek/whatever & then hoping that you are rescued before you can get "medical assistance" for what ever pathogen/parasite/ chemical derivatives/ etc, that create some serious troubles for your digestive tract since ya didn't want to take the time to do at least a lil bit of work to help improve your chances....You are already in a world of crap if it is a survival situation... take a needless risk.. Yup..that's the ticket...
Geeez...
 :sarcasm:


 I think Boiling is key for most situations when it comes to water borne crap.... chemicals like farm runoff... well ya gonna have to take your chances.


  I've said enough.. I have dealt with gastro-enteritis for about 2 weeks at one time in my life, & it is not a good thing... So..You just drink up that water & hope ya don't get it... Sure fire way to take your life, when ya need water to survive, is to get the Sheeits... You think you are dehydrated?   Get some of that "running trots" & you not only have to deal with debilitating cramps & gut ache, but all the dehydration effects...


 OOOppps.. I rambled along too long...


Good subject... But thinking about some of the complications of the decisions ya may make in a bad circumstance like a survival situation, might lend itself to some looking for good knowledge & not just the mentality of..


"I'm tough, I can handle it"...<--- Many who thought that way are bones & dust...


 ;)


 


I'm curious...I wonder where the leaves blow...
 ;)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: imnukensc on September 26, 2013, 06:22:58 PM
My highest priority is to stay out of survival situations.

An ounce of prevention...

Best answer I've seen so far, but keep batting it around guys!
Title: Re: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: PetrifiedWood on September 26, 2013, 08:01:54 PM
My highest priority is to stay out of survival situations.

An ounce of prevention...

Best answer I've seen so far, but keep batting it around guys!

Wife and I were discussing this today. Most folks who plan well enough to bring a good survival kit are probably less likely to need one than the type of people who head out without one.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Trekster on September 27, 2013, 12:07:36 AM
They used to make this stuff called Polar Pure, we used it on Scout hikes and at Philmont.

Great stuff. One jar would last you, like, a month or longer! It had iodine crystals in it and all you had to do was add untreated water to the jar and wait a half hour, shake it, and then use the dropper cap to dispense it into everyone's bottles!

Unfortunately it went the way of the dodo due to methheads everywhere buying (http://bladesandbushcraft.com/Smileys/krystl-white/censored.gif) tons of it. Apparently it was useful for making recreational drugs :mad:

PMZ
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 27, 2013, 11:10:04 AM
My highest priority is to stay out of survival situations.

An ounce of prevention...

Best answer I've seen so far, but keep batting it around guys!

The title of this thread isn't "If You Had A Choice To Be In A Survival Situation..."

I pretty sure people aren't reading this post because there intending to get in a survival situation.  On the contrary people don't intend to be in survival situations they're unpredictable and most times unpreventable.

I'm just saying, this isn't a pointless topic.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Wilderbeast on September 27, 2013, 11:42:09 AM
My highest priority is to stay out of survival situations.

An ounce of prevention...

Best answer I've seen so far, but keep batting it around guys!

The title of this thread isn't "If You Had A Choice To Be In A Survival Situation..."

I pretty sure people aren't reading this post because there intending to get in a survival situation.  On the contrary people don't intend to be in survival situations they're unpredictable and most times unpreventable.

I'm just saying, this isn't a pointless topic.

Nobody is saying this a pointless topic.

I'm going to disagree with your premise that most survival situations are unpredictable and most time unpreventable.  Most times they are completely predictable and entirely preventable with proper preparation and an application of common sense.

So since you missed my point let me explain it more clearly, the best way to deal with a "survival situation' is to prepare yourself with the skills and materials that keep you out of a survival situation.

Take something as basic as map reading.  Most "survival situations" involve getting lost.  If you have a map and compass, or even just a map and some basic dead reckoning skills then you know where you are and how to get to your destination, you don't need to "survive".  You just need to walk.

I'm going to stick with my highest priority being to not get into any survival situations.

I don't drive my truck until it breaks down, I do regular maintenance to prevent breakdowns, because breakdowns are both predictable and preventable.

Same with survival situations.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on September 27, 2013, 01:10:53 PM
I always think of a survival situation occurring after a plane crash in a remote mountainous region where they have taken every knife, water bottle, flame producing item, and almost everything else necessary for survival anywhere away from you.........right before you board. :P.   It happens!
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Wilderbeast on September 27, 2013, 01:15:15 PM
I always think of a survival situation occurring after a plane crash in a remote mountainous region where they have taken every knife, water bottle, flame producing item, and almost everything else necessary for survival anywhere away from you.........right before you board. :P.   It happens!

In that situation I would like an ice skate, a soccer ball, a beach full of fed-ex packages and at least one corpse wearing my size shoes.

(http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/01/21/science/castaway533.jpg)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on September 27, 2013, 01:17:18 PM
.....or at the very least , a surviving member of a Urugayan rugby team! :drool:
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: imnukensc on September 27, 2013, 01:41:27 PM
My highest priority is to stay out of survival situations.

An ounce of prevention...

Best answer I've seen so far, but keep batting it around guys!

The title of this thread isn't "If You Had A Choice To Be In A Survival Situation..."

I pretty sure people aren't reading this post because there intending to get in a survival situation.  On the contrary people don't intend to be in survival situations they're unpredictable and most times unpreventable.

I'm just saying, this isn't a pointless topic.

Sorry, WI_W, if you thought I inferred that this was a pointless topic.  That wasn't my intention at all, but I agree with Wilderbeast.  I've been in survival situations before, but they involved being 400 feet below the surface of the Pacific Ocean with several thousand feet of ocean below that on a submarine with fire or flooding or both at the same time.  Totally different scenario than what you're referring to in your original question, but the survival aspects are the same.  Planning, preparation, and training by myself and those around me kept my ass alive.  I don't see the difference between what I've described and a "bushcraft" situation other than it being totally different scenarios.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on September 27, 2013, 06:53:46 PM
Wilderbeast, Imnukensc no offense taken here.

In my original post the context of the question is that you're already in a "Survival Situation" (be it your fault or not).

I know that each scenario dictates a different priority but what I'm getting at is, in a situation where you were hundreds of miles from civilization and you had nothing but the cloths on your back and the knowledge in your head; What would be the highest priority to effect you survival?

Or, what's the first "project" you would commit calories, hydration and brain power to in order to effect survival?

I've never been in a survival situation (and hope never to be) so I'm looking forward to seeing your responses...   :)

You brought up a good point and I appreciate your contribution, I was just hoping for a suggestions on what would you do if you happen to find yourself in this situation.

FYI, countless thousands find themselves in Wilderness Survival Situations through no fault of their own most of them are refugees fleeing political and or religious persecution.  One of my very good friends is a Uganda national who has many relatives who have escape death only to have to scratch out an existence in the isolated Bush, many of them were under the age of 16.  If you interested Goggle The Invisible Children or Joseph Kony.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: USN Ret on November 07, 2013, 07:02:34 PM
First priority is air - as a SCUBA diver this could be a legitimate concern in a survival situation.

After that would be shelter (clothing, fire, etc) to maintain body temp..  Water is third.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Southern Illinoisian on December 16, 2013, 10:01:34 PM
Although this is a tough question and sitting here looking at the screen for a while I believe that I would have to go with a good knife. Some of the things going through my head were as follows.

Fire: fire bow, flint/steel, other resources from the land. So I would need/want a knife to manufacture those items.

Water/container: you aren't going to be able to disinfect water without a fire, unless you are going to make a coyote hole and lets face it you can still get sick from that. And you are going to be able to boil water with hot rocks in a concavity of a log. I haven't done it yet but it is on my list to do.

Shealter: No you don't need a knife to create a good debris shelter but, you will expend a lot more calories doing so. I believe that having a really good micro climate is worth its weight in gold, and a good night sleep.

If I were in a survival situation the first task that I would do would build fire/fire wood, second search for a water source, third catch up on some sleep. I have a 1 yr old. lol. Thanks for the good post. 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on December 17, 2013, 06:59:16 PM
Although this is a tough question and sitting here looking at the screen for a while I believe that I would have to go with a good knife. Some of the things going through my head were as follows.

Fire: fire bow, flint/steel, other resources from the land. So I would need/want a knife to manufacture those items.

Water/container: you aren't going to be able to disinfect water without a fire, unless you are going to make a coyote hole and lets face it you can still get sick from that. And you are going to be able to boil water with hot rocks in a concavity of a log. I haven't done it yet but it is on my list to do.

Shealter: No you don't need a knife to create a good debris shelter but, you will expend a lot more calories doing so. I believe that having a really good micro climate is worth its weight in gold, and a good night sleep.

If I were in a survival situation the first task that I would do would build fire/fire wood, second search for a water source, third catch up on some sleep. I have a 1 yr old. lol. Thanks for the good post.

I'd have to agree with you, making a fire by means of friction can be a pretty big calorie purchase but I'd want to use what strength I had going into a survival situation because after couple days of no food and no water it's going to be very difficult to start a fire on empty (probably with a headache to boot).

   
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Trekster on December 17, 2013, 08:17:12 PM
WI Woodsman, I'm glad you mentioned the "countless thousands" who mass-migrate and subsist on grass and roots due to political or religious persecution. Here in the States we are often lulled into thinking it will never happen to us. It's a bad policy to become so oblivious.

PMZ
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Southern Illinoisian on December 18, 2013, 04:00:33 PM
I always think of a survival situation occurring after a plane crash in a remote mountainous region where they have taken every knife, water bottle, flame producing item, and almost everything else necessary for survival anywhere away from you.........right before you board. :P.   It happens!

Even if they do take it from you, you are still authorized to put the "contraban" in your luggage. So in all reality .... if you survive the crash and the plane is still in somewhat condition .... you still have access to your equipment.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on December 18, 2013, 04:30:48 PM
I always think of a survival situation occurring after a plane crash in a remote mountainous region where they have taken every knife, water bottle, flame producing item, and almost everything else necessary for survival anywhere away from you.........right before you board. :P.   It happens!

Even if they do take it from you, you are still authorized to put the "contraban" in your luggage. So in all reality .... if you survive the crash and the plane is still in somewhat condition .... you still have access to your equipment.
There lies the rub..... in my mind, I was recalling the scene of United flight 232 that cartwheeled down the runway at the Sioux City, IA airport back in the late '80s  after a hydraulic failure.   The contents of the luggage compartment were strewn for a half mile in all directions and being redistributed over a wide area in 35 mph winds and in a standing cornfield to boot.   Finding your SAK & Bic in that situation would have very difficult! ???
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Southern Illinoisian on December 18, 2013, 04:58:44 PM
I always think of a survival situation occurring after a plane crash in a remote mountainous region where they have taken every knife, water bottle, flame producing item, and almost everything else necessary for survival anywhere away from you.........right before you board. :P.   It happens!

Even if they do take it from you, you are still authorized to put the "contraban" in your luggage. So in all reality .... if you survive the crash and the plane is still in somewhat condition .... you still have access to your equipment.
There lies the rub..... in my mind, I was recalling the scene of United flight 232 that cartwheeled down the runway at the Sioux City, IA airport back in the late '80s  after a hydraulic failure.   The contents of the luggage compartment were strewn for a half mile in all directions and being redistributed over a wide area in 35 mph winds and in a standing cornfield to boot.   Finding your SAK & Bic in that situation would have very difficult! ???
I understand but if WE are all on the plane and we all survive. It will be a pretty good survival situation. ha
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on December 18, 2013, 05:26:36 PM
I always think of a survival situation occurring after a plane crash in a remote mountainous region where they have taken every knife, water bottle, flame producing item, and almost everything else necessary for survival anywhere away from you.........right before you board. :P.   It happens!

Even if they do take it from you, you are still authorized to put the "contraban" in your luggage. So in all reality .... if you survive the crash and the plane is still in somewhat condition .... you still have access to your equipment.
There lies the rub..... in my mind, I was recalling the scene of United flight 232 that cartwheeled down the runway at the Sioux City, IA airport back in the late '80s  after a hydraulic failure.   The contents of the luggage compartment were strewn for a half mile in all directions and being redistributed over a wide area in 35 mph winds and in a standing cornfield to boot.   Finding your SAK & Bic in that situation would have very difficult! ???
I understand but if WE are all on the plane and we all survive. It will be a pretty good survival situation. ha
For years, I flew up in 1st class for FREE, using points that my wife accumulated in her weekly business sojourns to Atlanta where her job was based.  Life was good!   Then after 9-11 they made the rulings banning the personal carry of basic survival items & life-sustaining necessities that I wouldn't leave the house without, let alone travel thousands of miles unprepared for eventualities beyond my control.

For that reason, I haven't flown since......nor will I, until those draconian rules are relaxed!  DAGNABIT >:(
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on December 19, 2013, 12:57:18 AM
I'm flying to Hotlanta soon.  My first stop after the car rental is for a knife, water, and a coupla space blankets.  Hafta (http://bladesandbushcraft.com/Smileys/krystl-white/censored.gif)can everything a few days later to fly home.  But I won't get caught with my pants down and my mother in the car.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Moe M. on December 19, 2013, 05:49:14 AM
I'm flying to Hotlanta soon.  My first stop after the car rental is for a knife, water, and a coupla space blankets.  Hafta (http://bladesandbushcraft.com/Smileys/krystl-white/censored.gif)can everything a few days later to fly home.  But I won't get caught with my pants down and my mother in the car.

  Max,  buy good stuff,  before leaving mail the stuff back to yourself at home,  next time you visit mail it back to where you'll be staying, or if visting with your Mom,  leave the stuff with her until you return.
 
  The crap we all have to go through to pacify politicians is silly,  we ought to hire adults in the first place,  then have them go through a training process on their own dime before they start work,  and we shouldn't promote them when they screw up.   >:(
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on December 19, 2013, 06:01:37 AM
Yeah,  Mom's flying in from Kauai.  Island life isn't her cup of tea.  Going for a homesteading plot.  Another 30 acres butting up to the initial buy is available.  So we're gearing up to develop the land for self sustainability.  North GA is ideal.  If it works out...
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Moe M. on December 19, 2013, 07:04:23 AM
Yeah,  Mom's flying in from Kauai.  Island life isn't her cup of tea.  Going for a homesteading plot.  Another 30 acres butting up to the initial buy is available.  So we're gearing up to develop the land for self sustainability.  North GA is ideal.  If it works out...

  Good for you guy's,  My Sister in law has lived on Kauai for the last 35 years and loves it, it's a great place to visit but I'll take the East Coast here any day.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: abo4ster on February 02, 2014, 11:52:59 AM


In that situation I would like an ice skate, a soccer ball, a beach full of fed-ex packages and at least one corpse wearing my size shoes.

(http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/01/21/science/castaway533.jpg)

Ha!  I was out at David Wescott's a couple months ago and he has those Wilson handprint volleyballs all over his office.  He and Steve Watts were the consultants for Castaway.  Fireplow, ice skate axe, stone tools, etc. were all them.  Good stuff and great example of needing to be able to adapt to the situation.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on February 02, 2014, 11:56:15 AM
Wilson! :banana:
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: madmax on February 02, 2014, 12:01:52 PM
That durn iceskate scene gives me nightmares.

Guess it's because of having braces in the 60's...owww.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Southern Illinoisian on February 03, 2014, 03:58:33 PM
That durn iceskate scene gives me nightmares.

Guess it's because of having braces in the 60's...owww.

AAAhhhh back when braces were made of wood.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: customfiresteels on March 20, 2014, 08:22:51 AM
Highest priority to me varies with the situation. If it is freezing cold then it is shelter, if it is very hot then it is water and so on. (rule of three's)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Draco on April 27, 2014, 10:46:22 AM
Well I can now give the official NASAR answer to this question.  Positive Mental Attitude aka Will to Live.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: PetrifiedWood on April 27, 2014, 10:59:00 AM
I'm flying to Hotlanta soon.  My first stop after the car rental is for a knife, water, and a coupla space blankets.  Hafta (http://bladesandbushcraft.com/Smileys/krystl-white/censored.gif)can everything a few days later to fly home.  But I won't get caught with my pants down and my mother in the car.

Mail it to yourself back home right before you go to the airport.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Mudman on April 27, 2014, 11:48:32 AM
First priority for me would be air.  :D

After that water, then shelter.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: WI_Woodsman on April 27, 2014, 12:22:12 PM
Well I can now give the official NASAR answer to this question.  Positive Mental Attitude aka Will to Live.

What's the first "project" you would commit calories, hydration and brain power to in order to effect survival?
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Old Philosopher on April 27, 2014, 02:46:20 PM
Well I can now give the official NASAR answer to this question.  Positive Mental Attitude aka Will to Live.

What's the first "project" you would commit calories, hydration and brain power to in order to effect survival?

For me, that took a moment to ponder. You said I was committing "hydration" to the project, so that tells me I have a source of potable water to generation some sweat, right?  ;)

Basically it would b a toss up depending upon some immediate factors.
If I had my lighter with me, I'd consider a fire something I could put together in just a few moments, so my priority would probably be shelter. That would definitely be the case if the weather was threatening in any way.
But if I knew I was only going to get fire with much effort, and stick-rubbing, I'd have to put my effort into that first before wearing myself out building a shelter. Best case scenario with me and friction fires would be an all day project.  :P
Rain: shelter first. No rain: fire first, then shelter.
In a typical non-survival situation, I always prefer to get my shelter secured, and then relax building and tending the fire. Of course, under those conditions I always have a reliable means for making fire, so it's relaxing, and not panic time.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Draco on April 28, 2014, 07:30:57 PM
Well I can now give the official NASAR answer to this question.  Positive Mental Attitude aka Will to Live.

What's the first "project" you would commit calories, hydration and brain power to in order to effect survival?

From there NASAR is teaching that it depends on what will kill you first.  If it is the cold rain build a shelter and fire.  If it is dehydration find water.  I agree with that by the way. 

I would add to their training that keeping busy doing something helps you keep that PMA.  Setting around feeling sorry for yourself would be a killer. 
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: rolandsilvajr on April 28, 2014, 08:07:27 PM
Survival has and always will be first priority on core temperature control. If you can maintain your proper body temperature then hydration is next then based on how remote and probability of rescued then food or rescue next.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Bearhunter on April 28, 2014, 09:25:28 PM
Warmth and shelter!

Sent from my SCH-S738C using Tapatalk

Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on April 28, 2014, 09:58:41 PM
Survival has and always will be first priority on core temperature control. If you can maintain your proper body temperature then hydration is next then based on how remote and probability of rescued then food or rescue next.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Cody & I agree with you 8)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: hiwa on August 07, 2014, 05:04:47 PM
My old ( haha 40+ years ago) survival instructor I had kept telling us that when your in a survival situation , you will usually know it and the first thing to do  is sit down , relax and don't panic. Assess your situation , surroundings, weather, your physical status , and plan from there.

The time of day it happens matters also. If nightfall is coming , maybe shelter and a fire are first order. If your not injured , count your blessings and take it from there. If the weather is hot , water may be the pressing thing. Whatever the situation , you will have on you whatever you have , so going prepared ( most of us bushcraft types do) is always important and dressing a little warmer than the weather dictates is always a rule of thumb for me. You can always peel off if too hot.

I always have a knife and means to make fire on me and adequate clothing.
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Satchmo on August 08, 2014, 04:20:02 PM
For our SAR certification the priorities, regardless of the situation - as long as you are hoping to be found - are

First Aid
Fire
Shelter
Signals
Water
Food

Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: kanukkarhu on August 08, 2014, 04:29:36 PM
(Why hasn't anyone answered the obvious: chocolate?!?)
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: hiwa on August 08, 2014, 08:52:00 PM
(Why hasn't anyone answered the obvious: chocolate?!?)

My survival mojo tells me your probably gonna shine up the bottom of a Coke can to make a parabolic reflector , but in reality your going to eat it for the calories !
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: kanukkarhu on August 08, 2014, 09:42:23 PM

(Why hasn't anyone answered the obvious: chocolate?!?)

My survival mojo tells me your probably gonna shine up the bottom of a Coke can to make a parabolic reflector , but in reality your going to eat it for the calories !
Lol! ;D
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on August 08, 2014, 09:59:47 PM

(Why hasn't anyone answered the obvious: chocolate?!?)

My survival mojo tells me your probably gonna shine up the bottom of a Coke can to make a parabolic reflector , but in reality your going to eat it for the calories !
Lol! ;D
+1 :rofl:
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Bill Hilly on August 08, 2014, 10:44:58 PM
My old ( haha 40+ years ago) survival instructor I had kept telling us that when your in a survival situation , you will usually know it and the first thing to do  is sit down , relax and don't panic. Assess your situation , surroundings, weather, your physical status , and plan from there.

The time of day it happens matters also. If nightfall is coming , maybe shelter and a fire are first order. If your not injured , count your blessings and take it from there. If the weather is hot , water may be the pressing thing. Whatever the situation , you will have on you whatever you have , so going prepared ( most of us bushcraft types do) is always important and dressing a little warmer than the weather dictates is always a rule of thumb for me. You can always peel off if too hot.

I always have a knife and means to make fire on me and adequate clothing.

I don't think I could have said it any better!
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: Lamewolf on August 09, 2014, 06:08:00 AM
1 Address any injuries or illness
2 Shelter/fire
3 Hydration
4 Signal
5 Food
Title: Re: What is the highest priority in a wilderness survival situation?
Post by: wolfy on August 09, 2014, 11:56:15 AM
^I'll buy that. :cheers: