Author Topic: The dyed wood you guys use.  (Read 10203 times)

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Offline WoodsWoman

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The dyed wood you guys use.
« on: April 11, 2012, 10:14:01 AM »
I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask , but do you guys make your own dyed burl wood for your scales?  ( gosh I hope I'm using the right terminology there).

I've been doing some googling, trying to find an answer on HOW they are dyed and if those blocks are dyed all the way through with that color or not.    So far I cannot find an answer.

When looking at the pictures Red put up.. it looks like a block cut in half so the markings are the same on each side.   Thats what had me wondering if the block is dyed all the way through.   OR am I mistaken?

I'm not looking to make my own knife.. I'm more interested in carving dyed wood for pendants or other small things.   I love the look of those woods your using for your knives and would like to incorporate that into my carvings.

I'd love to learn more about this ..  on  how its done.  The depth a dye will go. 

And what do you guys do with your leftover peices that are too small to use on a knife? 

Thanks.

WW.
On particularly rough days when I'm sure I can't possibly endure, I like to remind myself that my track record for getting through bad days so far is 100% and that's pretty good.

Offline greyhound352

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2012, 10:27:14 AM »
I think most people buy their color burl products. The process of stabilizing the wood is where they are injecting the color resin into the wood.

I just purchased a set for an upcoming knife build from eBay.
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Offline Red

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2012, 10:32:07 AM »
hey WW,
  the wood i use is stabilized wood. here is how the stabilization process works in a nut shell:

a larger piece of the wood is selected. the desired color for the wood is mixed with acrylic resins, and is put into something like a pressure cooker (minus the heat). the dye and resins are pressurized, and it FORCES the dye and resin through all the pores in the wood.  what this does is fill all the gaps in the grain with that acrylic epoxy, essentially sealing the wood from the inside out. after this process, the wood will never take on water, oil, or any other liquid. it will not warp, crack from lack of moisture, or rot. hence the word "stabilized". the wood is now stabilized and will never be harmed by the elements.

if the artist is good at what he does (its more art than science) then the dye not only goes all the way through, but it goes through evenly. after that block of wood is stabilized, it is thrown on the saws and quartered up into sets of scales or blocks for wood turners.

good stabilization is expensive, and the pieces are one of a kind. you will never get 2 sets that are the same. PM me and i will hook you up with some places you can purchase from :D


and as for the left over pieces (if there are any) i use those parts for matching firesteels ;)
"Big drama next few hours.. But whatever happens, no matter what they tell you.. Don't let 'em take them chains off me.."

Offline WoodsWoman

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2012, 10:39:37 AM »
  Shoot. .  I was hoping it was something easy...    :(

I dont suppose using my canner would work?   :S

So they are pretty hard solid when you get them.   I would then guess carving them with a knife wouldnt be so easy?   How about a scroll saw.. will that cut ok with stabilized wood?     I'm thinking you guys use a bandsaw to shape out the scales?

So if I back up my thinking here..    Carve a burl into something and THEN stain/dye it for jewelery purposes would probably be my best bet.  WIth a sealer over the top. 

Thank you guys for your imput...   

WW.




On particularly rough days when I'm sure I can't possibly endure, I like to remind myself that my track record for getting through bad days so far is 100% and that's pretty good.

Offline Red

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2012, 10:42:35 AM »
i know it takes a long time for you to load videos, but i think this is something you can do at home. just get some wood dye in the colors you want (substitute the wood hardener for denatured alcohol). make sure you get wood dye, and not wood stain. stains wont penetrate all the way through.


"Big drama next few hours.. But whatever happens, no matter what they tell you.. Don't let 'em take them chains off me.."

Offline WoodsWoman

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2012, 11:28:46 AM »
Whoa.. thanks for that video!   I can DO that.    Sad thing is.. I KNEW what a brake bleeder pump was.  **amazed at self**

That would work for small pieces.  yay!

And I can get lots and lots of bone...   no problem there.   

I may be on to some new hobby... :)   

Thank you guys.  I'm glad I asked now.

WW.
On particularly rough days when I'm sure I can't possibly endure, I like to remind myself that my track record for getting through bad days so far is 100% and that's pretty good.

Offline MATT CHAOS

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2012, 11:54:41 AM »
i know it takes a long time for you to load videos, but i think this is something you can do at home. just get some wood dye in the colors you want (substitute the wood hardener for denatured alcohol). make sure you get wood dye, and not wood stain. stains wont penetrate all the way through.


Why substitute the hardener for denatured alcohol?  Is that just for pressurizing the dye through the wood?  If so then, another step for hardening the dyed wood?

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Offline WoodsWoman

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2012, 12:06:41 PM »
 I think I found some dye that will work.   Its here :   http://www.dickblick.com/products/procion-mx-fiber-reactive-cold-water-dye/#description

Most folks are using this dye for tie-dyeing..but its also used for other fibers.  Including wood.

It says to use alchohol for deep penetration on wood , under resources.     And after watching that video I wonder if this dye powder can be mixed with that hardener he had next to that jar... ??   Any thoughts on that?

And I found a gallon sized pickle jar.  More room for bigger pieces maybe..?   Do you think that brake pump would still be as effective on a larger jar?


WW. 

On particularly rough days when I'm sure I can't possibly endure, I like to remind myself that my track record for getting through bad days so far is 100% and that's pretty good.

Offline Red

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2012, 12:32:00 PM »
this is the kind of dye i would recommend:

http://www.homesteadfinishingproducts.com/htdocs/TransTint.htm
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Offline Red

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2012, 12:33:39 PM »
the wood hardener is only if you want to kind of stabilize the wood. in which case you would skip the denatured alcohol, and just add your dye to the wood hardener.

also, you will need a separate jar for each color  you plan on using ;)
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Offline WoodsWoman

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2012, 01:33:38 PM »
Those are more expensive, but they are ready to go right out of the bottle. And they will work with the new air brush I bought.   Thats a plus.    And will mix with just about anything by the looks of it.   

Is this technique called  'filled pore finish' ?   I was looking in the book dept. and was wondering if thats what this is called.

The more I learn on this the more I want to get going on larger stump carving...  I could color them up rather well with this idea I think... 

Thank you again.

WW.
On particularly rough days when I'm sure I can't possibly endure, I like to remind myself that my track record for getting through bad days so far is 100% and that's pretty good.

Offline Red

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2012, 03:37:23 PM »
Those are more expensive, but they are ready to go right out of the bottle. And they will work with the new air brush I bought.   Thats a plus.    And will mix with just about anything by the looks of it.   

Is this technique called  'filled pore finish' ?   I was looking in the book dept. and was wondering if thats what this is called.

The more I learn on this the more I want to get going on larger stump carving...  I could color them up rather well with this idea I think... 

Thank you again.

WW.

the dye's are expensive, but one 4oz bottle mixes 1/2 gallon of dye. thats a LOT! cabinet guys get whole kitchens done with one 4oz bottle, so imagine how far it would go on little pieces here and there.

i dont know about "filled pore finish". not really a wood guy :)
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Offline Barbarossa Bushman

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2012, 08:16:51 AM »
Thanks for the video on this. At first I thought it was UTC!  ;D I will have to check this out more for sure.
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Offline Dano

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #13 on: April 13, 2012, 09:50:12 AM »
Not to be too nerdy, but something of a safety warning...taking something down to 28" of vacuum is 3 atmospheres difference from the room you are in.  That's a lot of negative pressure on a non-pressurized glass container.  Just be extremely careful and be sure to wear safety glasses.  It won't explode, but do the opposite-implode.  It will still splash the hardener around and I wouldn't want any to get into your eyes.  I'd think a canning jar would be safer than a pickle jar.

A great setup would be if you had, or could find, an old pressure cooker with a good lid and seal.  If you had an old compressor from a freezer, refrigerator, drinking fountain, pop machine...whatever, or knew someone with a vacuum pump, you'd be set like the pros.  AND be able to do bigger pieces.

There are a lot of things we can do, just be really careful! 

Yes, the bleeder pump will work on a larger jar, it will just take more pumps to get it down to a vacuum.  They don't move much volume...like less than a cubic inch per stroke.

Offline Red

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #14 on: April 13, 2012, 10:36:19 AM »
yes, and DO NOT EXPOSE THE HARDENER TO AN OPEN FLAME!!!!!! it contains ketones, and if you arent sure what i mean just google "flash fire".
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Offline MATT CHAOS

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2012, 11:26:59 AM »
How important (or not) is it to stabilize antler horn and bone when using those for knife handles?  I am wondering if it is needed or not.  Anyone have some information or opinions on this?

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Offline Mammoth

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #16 on: May 04, 2012, 02:00:52 PM »
I only stabilize bone or horn if the customer is using it for game preparation, if not....wax and polish finish works ok and protects from the elements.
Bone and horn are very stable from the get-go, the only thing to watch for is the porous inner part of bone which is where stabilization helps.

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Offline MATT CHAOS

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #17 on: May 04, 2012, 02:11:24 PM »
I only stabilize bone or horn if the customer is using it for game preparation, if not....wax and polish finish works ok and protects from the elements.
Bone and horn are very stable from the get-go, the only thing to watch for is the porous inner part of bone which is where stabilization helps.

Tom

Thanks.  I was wondering about this for a long time.
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Offline Red

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Re: The dyed wood you guys use.
« Reply #18 on: May 06, 2012, 12:37:32 AM »
thanks for chiming in Tom :) if anyone here didnt know, Mammoth here actually DOES wood and bone stabilization professionally in the UK :thumbsup:
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