Trips Outside the Comfort Zone

[04man]

I would like to hear about your outings that didn't go exactly as planned. Snow storm catch you? Vehicle brake down way out in the back country? Ever been rescued?

[Bearhunter]

I would like to hear about your outings that didn't go exactly as planned. Snow storm catch you? Vehicle brake down way out in the back country? Ever been rescued?

Nothing ever seems to go as planned when you live n the woods.
Basically, we EXPECT something to go wrong.
We have just learned to go with the flow...
Expect for the worst and be prepared for it

[kanukkarhu]

So many things have gone south on me.

Getting stuck in the truck - check.
Getting "turned around" in the woods (I don't get "lost") - check.
Having the weather turn on me - check.
Having someone shoot above my head - check.
etc. - check!

But believe it or not, I think the worst, most miserable thing that I can remember was when I left my SAK stuck in a birch tree (in Nova Scotia) where I left it after cleaning a bunny.  I walked back to get it in a snow storm, and near died (or so it seemed at the time.)  MY buddy stayed at the shanty.  I was wore out from the snow, and it took a long time going back.  I thought I might not make it all the way home - all for a SAK. 

Then there was the time I thought I misplaced that same hunting buddy.  I recall thinking, "Man, Bill's wife is gonna kill me!"  THAT was a pretty bad moment.

Then there was that one time when that really strange cry/call happened while we were walking out of the bush at night...

KK

[Old Philosopher]

I would like to hear about your outings that didn't go exactly as planned. .....

Nothing ever seems to go as planned when you live n the woods.
Basically, we EXPECT something to go wrong.
We have just learned to go with the flow...
Expect for the worst and be prepared for it

Yeah...what BH said.
That includes once raking the snow pack off a roof and having the whole thing let go at once. I ended up buried to my thighs in snow. It went from a simple snow removal plan to digging myself out of this 'avalanche' before I could move. And this was two feet from the wall of my cabin!  Of course, all I had was a roof rake, and no shovel. 

[04man]

This weekend weighs heavily on my mind. Following tracks back out that had been covered in snow. Legs cramping up. I brought what I needed to stay the night but my partner was poorly outfitted. He walked me into the ground getting outa there.

That was Sunday, it's Wednesday now and I'm still feel'n drained. My calorie calculator reads that I burned somewhere between 8,000+ to 10,000+ calories. I'm getting a little old for that.

[madmax]

Awright. Here's my bear story. I was kayaking a stupid little creek in Alaska...solo...he was on a carcass.  He charged me in a  class V rapid.  It took 8 hours of hiking to get out of the gorge.  Short story.

[Old Philosopher]

Awright. Here's my bear story. I was kayaking a stupid little creek in Alaska...solo...he was on a carcass.  He charged me in a  class V rapid.  It took 8 hours of hiking to get out of the gorge.  Short story.

Oops! I take it the bear now owns a kayak? Stupid bear!

[madmax]

You've heard that story.  Back off old man!

[madmax]

Hope that's taken lightly.

[wolfy]

I would think a trip to the local carwash for a good pressure-washing of the inside of that 'yak was in order after that experience

[kanukkarhu]

Awright. Here's my bear story. I was kayaking a stupid little creek in Alaska...solo...he was on a carcass.  He charged me in a  class V rapid.  It took 8 hours of hiking to get out of the gorge.  Short story.

Holy cow! That tops anything I got... Yikes!!!

[Old Philosopher]

Speaking of "outside my comfort zone", I spent 4 years in Nebraska. Does that count? 
(The winking smilie is for Wolfy.... )

[madmax]

You're a buncha calloused old farts who don't appreciate a good story.  Bleh@!

[wsdstan]

The most trouble I have had in my outhings usually involved one or more of the following:

Snow
Rapids
Spring turkey hunts when the bears were out with cubs
Elk during the rut
No crampons, no ice axe, and no thought process

If I drank to excess then I believe my oft used phrase would have been "Here, hold my beer and watch this."

All in all I have been lucky with no serious injury.......... just a little lost time.

[Old Philosopher]

You're a buncha calloused old farts who don't appreciate a good story.  Bleh@!

Not calloused. It's just that we can laugh about it because we've also been in those situations where the sphincter sucks wind like a piccolo!

[Wilderbeast]

I once stepped out of my comfort zone, off of a side walk and was hit by a truck.  In Florence, Italy.  Once my wife determined that I was not seriously injured I was berated for not looking both ways.

It was a small truck, but it hurt.  I did get to use my Italian to buy a new shirt.  The one I was wearing having been shredded by the impact with the truck.

This happened outside, so it should count. 

[Old Philosopher]

I once stepped out of my comfort zone, off of a side walk and was hit by a truck.  In Florence, Italy.  Once my wife determined that I was not seriously injured I was berated for not looking both ways.

It was a small truck, but it hurt.  I did get to use my Italian to buy a new shirt.  The one I was wearing having been shredded by the impact with the truck.

This happened outside, so it should count. 

ROFLAO! I've met more than a few folks whose 'comfort zone' ended at the curb. I knew one guy who I'm sure would have died from exposure if he was more than 10 feet from a city sidewalk! Hahahaha!

[Draco]

Not a single really bad incident.  We don't get unexpected snow like they do in the mountains.  I hike in the winter but the weather reports have never failed me.   I have been in a few bad rain storms.  One at Au Sable Point with a storm that blew off Lake Superior I had a few concerns about all the cracking trees and falling limbs and the whole lightening thing but everyone survived. 

[PetrifiedWood]

I have managed to escape any seriously unplanned outdoor experiences becuase I lived in a city during my bold and unwise years. Now that I have ready access to outdoor recreation, I am less bold, and more likely to carefully plan outings so as to prepare for or avoid unexpected problems.

But I also probably missed out on a lot of adventure that way.

[Old Philosopher]

I have managed to escape any seriously unplanned outdoor experiences becuase I lived in a city during my bold and unwise years. Now that I have ready access to outdoor recreation, I am less bold, and more likely to carefully plan outings so as to prepare for or avoid unexpected problems.

But I also probably missed out on a lot of adventure that way.

I think someone once said that an Adventure is something you experience, and live to tell stories about it.

[PetrifiedWood]

It would seem as though adventure could be an "adverse venture", from a person with no background in etymology.

[Old Philosopher]

It would seem as though adventure could be an "adverse venture", from a person with no background in etymology.

By definition, it's rarely a well planed event:

1.	a risky undertaking of unknown outcome
2.	an exciting or unexpected event or course of events
3.	obsolete
	a.  danger or misadventure
	b.  chance

[04man]

Well dang!
It would seem I've had plenty of ventures and very few adventures!

[Draco]

Might have one this summer.  My hiking buddy wants to do a trail listed as "Gradient: very difficult" in the books of MI UP hikes I have.  It calls the trip "not for the faint of heart" and says "you will lose count of the breath taking views, the gut-clenching climbs, and the perilous descents."   I told him we are going to have to train a lot more than we have been if we want to tackle that one. 

[PetrifiedWood]

Draco, sounds like you might want to bring some climbing gear!

But it also sounds like some awesome photo opportunities as well.

[Draco]

I hope it does not take climbing gear.  I don't have that kind of upper body strength anymore.  I am kind of hoping we come to our senses before trying this one but that will probably not happen anytime soon.      In Tom's book he goes out of his way to mention emergency services are 100 miles away. 

In all seriousness I will not do it if we both don't get in pretty good shape by the time we leave.  We can just as easily do the Porkies and Lake of the Clouds just a few miles north. 

[RBM]

Too many to count. Was way back fly fishing a backwater creek and ended up doing a truly stupid thing (too young at that time to know better) and drank straight from the creek. Fortunately I think the water was so full of tannin from decaying leaves (see natural antiseptics) that I did not contract any pathogens. Then there was a bear or two up in the Georgia mountains while fly fishing. Copperheads swimming down stream in the mountains. The moccasins in a south GA stream and in FL. Too many scrapes with rattlers. A few coral snakes. Gators thinking I have food or I am food but gators don't climb trees. Neither do hogs. No direct polecat encounters...yet. Guinea wasps under Palmetto fronds while hiking. Yellow jacket nest under leaves I missed and stepped on. Yeah, stuff happens when you spend a lot of time in the woods. I have been fortunate over the years.

A note about Guinea Wasps. I have been stung or bit by a lot. lol Big red wasps, black flies, horseflies, deerflies, yellow jackets......but the most painful of them all is that little Guinea Wasp. For a little wasp it packs a big punch. Worse when a whole nest of them hit you. Do yourself a favor, please do check under Palmetto fronds "before" moving them.

http://wiki.bugwood.org/Archive:Hazards/The_Social_Wasps_and_Bees

[Old Philosopher]

Now you have me on a research mission, RBM. We have dozens of "paper wasps", and very few yellow-jackets. They are definitely not Guinea wasps, nor bald faced hornets (I know those all too well). These paper wasps are bigger than yellow-jackets. The yellow-jackets are bothersome around food areas, but rarely sting. These other wasps are very aggressive.

[wolfy]

I think RBM might be referring to the Eastern Yellowjacket, Ol' P.......they build underground nests and are especially aggressive and sting in droves and multiple times.  The yellow jacket that darts sideways around your open pop can is more of a PITA than anything else.  We have BOTH kinds

[Old Philosopher]

I think RBM might be referring to the Eastern Yellowjacket, Ol' P.......they build underground nests and are especially aggressive and sting in droves and multiple times.  The yellow jacket that darts sideways around your open pop can is more of a PITA than anything else.  We have BOTH kinds

The link he provided showed a picture of the Guinea Wasp. I've never seen them, and actually never heard the name before. The article says they can be mistaken for yellow-jackets just because of the color, but the picture shows a slender body, and thin wings.
As a pre-teen, we used to call those bothersome yellow-jackets "sweat bees", because it always seemed they were attracted to salty, sweaty skin.

[Wilderbeast]

I think RBM might be referring to the Eastern Yellowjacket, Ol' P.......they build underground nests and are especially aggressive and sting in droves and multiple times.  The yellow jacket that darts sideways around your open pop can is more of a PITA than anything else.  We have BOTH kinds

The link he provided showed a picture of the Guinea Wasp. I've never seen them, and actually never heard the name before. The article says they can be mistaken for yellow-jackets just because of the color, but the picture shows a slender body, and thin wings.
As a pre-teen, we used to call those bothersome yellow-jackets "sweat bees", because it always seemed they were attracted to salty, sweaty skin.

It's funny, the sweat bees in this area are hardly a bother and the sting is not too bad, what we call yellow jackets are ground dwellers from hell, will swarm you if you disturb them and the sting feels like a hot nail drivin into your skin. 

A dozen stings like that will ruin your day, trust me on that  .

[wolfy]

I think RBM might be referring to the Eastern Yellowjacket, Ol' P.......they build underground nests and are especially aggressive and sting in droves and multiple times.  The yellow jacket that darts sideways around your open pop can is more of a PITA than anything else.  We have BOTH kinds

The link he provided showed a picture of the Guinea Wasp. I've never seen them, and actually never heard the name before. The article says they can be mistaken for yellow-jackets just because of the color, but the picture shows a slender body, and thin wings.
As a pre-teen, we used to call those bothersome yellow-jackets "sweat bees", because it always seemed they were attracted to salty, sweaty skin.

It's funny, the sweat bees in this area are hardly a bother and the sting is not too bad, what we call yellow jackets are ground dwellers from hell, will swarm you if you disturb them and the sting feels like a hot nail drivin into your skin. 

A dozen stings like that will ruin your day, trust me on that  .

Yeah, that's the one's I was referring to, WB.....they're BAAAD .   I worked on a state park crew in my college years and one of our duties was trimming roadsides with idiot-sticks ala 'Cool Hand Luke' .   Once or twice a year someone would chop into one of those underground lairs and the kamikaze attack of yellow jackets would ensue........hard to outrun 'em, too

[Old Philosopher]

Here's my take on the whole thing: A wasp is a wasp, regardless of what kind of jacket it's wearing. They are only mildly useful as pollinators, and serve about as much purpose (IMO) as mosquitoes. While I have a benevolent attitude toward Nature in general, when it comes to things that dole out more pain than pleasure, "Thou shalt not suffer one to live!".... 
While it's nice to know the differences between a Kodiak, Coastal Brown, and Grizzly bear, the fact remains they will all eat you given the chance. Seems to hold true for the various species of wasps, also.

[Draco]

Speaking of stings how many of you carry an epipen during the bee season?  Even though I have been stung and never had a problem that is something you can develop at any time in your life and being 50 miles from a road is the wrong time to find you have developed an issue.  I think there should be at least one epipen with every group.   

[wolfy]

  I need to carry one and I don't

[Wilderbeast]

Speaking of stings how many of you carry an epipen during the bee season?  Even though I have been stung and never had a problem that is something you can develop at any time in your life and being 50 miles from a road is the wrong time to find you have developed an issue.  I think there should be at least one epipen with every group.

I don't carry an epipen, but your point is well taken, the next sting could be the one you have a bad reaction to.

I do generally have benedryl with me and have needed it on more than one occasion. 

Do you happen to know the shelf life of an epipen?

[kanukkarhu]

I was canoeing on a small cold spring fed lake one gorgeous summer day with my soon-to-be bride. We had a great day and when it came time to leave, I left her in the truck and waddled gingerly (I was barefoot) off into the bush to change out of my cold wet stuff into dry clothes.  I was behind this berm of earth and started stripping off.  Having just gotten my wet stuff off and just starting the process of getting dressed, I heard something.  A kind of buzz or whine.

"Mosquitoes are real bad this afternoon," I thought to myself.

I looked down, and swarming up around my bare legs, making their way up to my goose-bumpley nether regions was a nest of yellow jackets.  I hauled my shorts on, held 'em up with one hand, and started flat out running (barefoot or not didn't seem that important all of a sudden) towards the Blue Goose (my '71 Chevy pick up), all the while yelling, "Start the truck!  Start the truck!"

The future Mrs. Karhu leaned over and started the Blue Goose, and I hit that seat, put 'er in gear and was off down the road all in one motion.

I knew then I should marry this one.

I left some clothes back there that day, and learned that yellow jackets can really sting on the soft unprotected parts.  Fortunately, nothing, um, too valuable was harmed in the making of this memory.

Edit: And no epi pen...

[Draco]

I don't carry an epipen, but your point is well taken, the next sting could be the one you have a bad reaction to.

I do generally have benedryl with me and have needed it on more than one occasion. 

Do you happen to know the shelf life of an epipen?

I don't.  My hiking buddy has the one we always take.  I will ask him to check it but if it is like most prescriptions it is one year even if it will actually last 5.  I know the pen was one cost and the insert was less. So the first purchase was the most expensive then you just buy the refill.  It was not cheap that is for sure.

[RBM]

I mean Guinea Wasps. They look like tiny Yellow Jackets and have a tiny paper nest. They build the nests under all kinds of stuff out of the weather, awnings, mailboxes,....Palmetto fronds. Usually anywhere from four to twenty of them. A Guinea Wasp sting makes a Yellow Jacket seem like an amateur. It buries its butt into your skin to drive the stinger and venom as deep as it can and it will just flutter there stinging away. A whole squadron of them will set you free. The venom is potent and very painful. Swelling, paralyzing, pains shooting, throbbing, and about every so often it feels like you are being stung all over again. I have had headaches from the venom too. Takes a lot longer to get over its sting than a Yellow Jacket. If you have never been stung by one, consider yourself fortunate.

Carry some tobacco in your first aid kit. Wet it and slap it on the sting(s) to draw out the pain and hopefully the venom. It will numb the pain at least. Take some antihistamine to counter the venom. Later when you are in your right mind again, clean and disinfect the sting(s) and put some calamine lotion on it to dry it up.

[madmax]

Those Guinea wasps will pop you good.  And they ain't shy about it.  There's always more than one. And they ARE everywhere down here.  They are not Yellow Jackets.

[Old Philosopher]

....
Carry some tobacco in your first aid kit. Wet it and slap it on the sting(s) to draw out the pain and hopefully the venom. Take some antihistamine to counter the venom. Later when you are in your right mind again, clean and disinfect the sting(s) and put some calamine lotion on it to dry it up.

Crushed plantain leaves work wonders on wasp stings. I've experimented with the paper wasps we have, and an untreated sting lasts (with me) about 15-20 minutes. If I chew up a plantain leaf, and squeeze the paste/juice on the sting, it's virtually gone in 3-5 minutes. I'm seriously considering making up some homemade salve from the stuff next spring.

[wolfy]

Guinea wasps are the most common wasp around here, too, but didn't know that was their name.....we just always called them WASPS!  I agree they are the WORST!   I picked a bag of seed corn out of the back of the pickup one time and tossed it up on my shoulder to carry it over to the planter, but I didn't see the wasp sitting on it.  It got caught between the bag and my neck which must have, not only pissed the wasp off, but squeezed every bit of venom out of it.  It just about knocked me out!  It started going dark and it looked like I was peering through a tunnel with a light at the end.....put me right on my knees

[RBM]

....
Carry some tobacco in your first aid kit. Wet it and slap it on the sting(s) to draw out the pain and hopefully the venom. Take some antihistamine to counter the venom. Later when you are in your right mind again, clean and disinfect the sting(s) and put some calamine lotion on it to dry it up.

Crushed plantain leaves work wonders on wasp stings. I've experimented with the paper wasps we have, and an untreated sting lasts (with me) about 15-20 minutes. If I chew up a plantain leaf, and squeeze the paste/juice on the sting, it's virtually gone in 3-5 minutes. I'm seriously considering making up some homemade salve from the stuff next spring.

A Guinea Wasp is not any ordinary paper wasp, nor is its sting. I wish it was.

[kanukkarhu]

Holy cow, these things sound horrible. Are they an import?

[RBM]

Holy cow, these things sound horrible. Are they an import?

No. Always been here as far as I know. Some articles say they are ordinary paper wasps. I have been stung by ordinary paper wasps that are a lot bigger. These little suckers are tiny.

This right here gives me the jitters.
http://www.pbase.com/red_slough_wma/image/128764822

[Old Philosopher]

....
Carry some tobacco in your first aid kit. Wet it and slap it on the sting(s) to draw out the pain and hopefully the venom. Take some antihistamine to counter the venom. Later when you are in your right mind again, clean and disinfect the sting(s) and put some calamine lotion on it to dry it up.

Crushed plantain leaves work wonders on wasp stings. I've experimented with the paper wasps we have, and an untreated sting lasts (with me) about 15-20 minutes. If I chew up a plantain leaf, and squeeze the paste/juice on the sting, it's virtually gone in 3-5 minutes. I'm seriously considering making up some homemade salve from the stuff next spring.

A Guinea Wasp is not any ordinary paper wasp, nor is its sting. I wish it was.

You mentioned tobacco as an analgesic. Just thought I throw the plantain info out here.

[RBM]

....
Carry some tobacco in your first aid kit. Wet it and slap it on the sting(s) to draw out the pain and hopefully the venom. Take some antihistamine to counter the venom. Later when you are in your right mind again, clean and disinfect the sting(s) and put some calamine lotion on it to dry it up.

Crushed plantain leaves work wonders on wasp stings. I've experimented with the paper wasps we have, and an untreated sting lasts (with me) about 15-20 minutes. If I chew up a plantain leaf, and squeeze the paste/juice on the sting, it's virtually gone in 3-5 minutes. I'm seriously considering making up some homemade salve from the stuff next spring.

A Guinea Wasp is not any ordinary paper wasp, nor is its sting. I wish it was.

You mentioned tobacco as an analgesic. Just thought I throw the plantain info out here.

I hear a lot of talk about plantain and I have seen it in plenty of books and references but I rarely run across it. Once in a while here but its just not that plentiful. I guess it might be in certain areas. I don't know about using it for an analgesic but I have seen mention for blood clotting along with Periwinkle. Willow is about the best natural analgesic I know of.

The reason I mentioned tobacco is that tobacco gives me immediate pain relief, sort of. I mean it numbs or deadens the affected area fairly quick. Kind of an external localized pain killer. The standard suggestion is to use ice to deaden the sting but unless its Winter, ice won't be around. At least not outdoors.

[madmax]

I see alot more further north from us RBM.

[wolfy]

I see alot more further north from us RBM.

Yeah, my yard is full of it

[Old Philosopher]

A person goes with what local, handy and effective. Like Wolfy, I have a plantain plant growing every 18" throughout my whole lawn area. Easy to grab a leaf when sitting on the patio. 
Historically, the best natural astringent would be yarrow to staunch blood flow, but it's not everywhere.