Author Topic: December 7, 1941  (Read 326 times)

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Offline boomer

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December 7, 1941
« on: December 08, 2022, 09:19:38 AM »
Yesterday was the anniversary of the attack on Pearl Harbor. The "Day that will live in infamy" received comparatively little recognition as far as I can tell  Maybe locally( though not in my area ) but nationally not so much if at all

It may be that the themes of democracy, unity of purpose and Citizen responsibility no longer fit our times.

The world has undeniably changed since 1941. Sometimes in unanticipated ways. Yet when we fail to remember where we were it can be hard to understand where we are.

December 7, 1941 is not a holiday nor cause for celebration but it is important I think and worth remembering.

Offline Pete Bog

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Re: December 7, 1941
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2022, 11:06:58 PM »
 :soap: ON

Our institutions of higher learning have had a paradigm shift in values. These so called Ivy League schools are supposed to be educating the future leaders of our country. That's the theory. And in some cases it works. It seems though, more often than not, that the leaders of industry, government, banking are put in place through family connections and/or alma mater loyalties. While this is nothing new and extends far back into history it seems to me that in about the 1970's a basic philosophical shift occurred within these institutions.

Now, these are just my personal observations over the past 60 years or so. But it seems we have gotten away from pricing things out at fair market value and have shifted into a 'whatever the market will bear' mentality. If this was confined to just the monetary pricing of goods it might be tolerable but there is a spillover in other facets of our everyday lives. It has become "I'm going to get as much for me as I can and as long as I've got mine, to he'll with everyone else."
 
The problem arises with the "He'll with everyone else" part. It would appear that very few leaders on a nationwide stage create policies that are good for the country as a whole. Multi million dollar bonuses in banking. Same for heads of industry. And politicians tack billions of dollars onto completely unrelated spending bills. Pork barrel spending to ensure they will be reelected. Because "they care and they brought the money to their home districts". And we eat it up. Shame on us. We are just as complicit in these fiascos as they are.

Early 90's was the last time I remember poppies being sold to raise money for Disabled American Veterans (DAV) The people that made the poppies, the veterans and the ladies auxiliary, all got to old and the market dried up. In short, the younger generations didn't care anymore. And the same goes for December 7th.   

I understand time marches on, wars and their veterans fade to the distant past, but no longer acknowledging them seems a bit selfish. And I blame the new philosophies of our Ivy Leaguers. They started this new way of thinking 50 years ago, and now we are seeing its effects.

The top one percent of Americas richest people own 32.1 percent of the nations wealth. There is nothing wrong with being wealthy. You work hard, you should be rewarded. But this group of people have profited to the detriment of everyone reading this rant. They have achieved riches that are not good for the country as a whole. And I blame the "whatever the market will bear" mindset.

I'm sure Moe will disagree. He always does. I can only assume he is a one percent that thinks paying 90,000 for new Suburban is OK. Jeez, it's a Chevy truck. We paid $2,700.00 for a new Chevy truck in '67. Back then we'd work about 2200 hours to pay for it. Now a minimum wage earner needs to work about 6000 hours. That is not parity. What changed? "Whatever the market will bear"

What's wrong with fair market value? What's wrong with doing something for the country as a whole? What's wrong with acknowledging our veterans and the sacrifices they made individually for our country as a whole? Not a thing.

Oh, and tax the rich!!?? Oh he!! no. That means the government gets the money and they have NO fiscal responsibility.  It needs to go back to the institutions that started this me, me, me crap. They need to instill a sense of personal responsibility to this country. Will it ever happen? No. Not in my or my children's lifetime.

But thanks for giving me the opportunity to blow that bit of rant off my chest.

 :soap:  OFF

Offline Moe M.

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Re: December 7, 1941
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2022, 06:30:57 AM »
:soap: ON

Our institutions of higher learning have had a paradigm shift in values. These so called Ivy League schools are supposed to be educating the future leaders of our country. That's the theory. And in some cases it works. It seems though, more often than not, that the leaders of industry, government, banking are put in place through family connections and/or alma mater loyalties. While this is nothing new and extends far back into history it seems to me that in about the 1970's a basic philosophical shift occurred within these institutions.

Now, these are just my personal observations over the past 60 years or so. But it seems we have gotten away from pricing things out at fair market value and have shifted into a 'whatever the market will bear' mentality. If this was confined to just the monetary pricing of goods it might be tolerable but there is a spillover in other facets of our everyday lives. It has become "I'm going to get as much for me as I can and as long as I've got mine, to he'll with everyone else."
 
The problem arises with the "He'll with everyone else" part. It would appear that very few leaders on a nationwide stage create policies that are good for the country as a whole. Multi million dollar bonuses in banking. Same for heads of industry. And politicians tack billions of dollars onto completely unrelated spending bills. Pork barrel spending to ensure they will be reelected. Because "they care and they brought the money to their home districts". And we eat it up. Shame on us. We are just as complicit in these fiascos as they are.

Early 90's was the last time I remember poppies being sold to raise money for Disabled American Veterans (DAV) The people that made the poppies, the veterans and the ladies auxiliary, all got to old and the market dried up. In short, the younger generations didn't care anymore. And the same goes for December 7th.   

I understand time marches on, wars and their veterans fade to the distant past, but no longer acknowledging them seems a bit selfish. And I blame the new philosophies of our Ivy Leaguers. They started this new way of thinking 50 years ago, and now we are seeing its effects.

The top one percent of Americas richest people own 32.1 percent of the nations wealth. There is nothing wrong with being wealthy. You work hard, you should be rewarded. But this group of people have profited to the detriment of everyone reading this rant. They have achieved riches that are not good for the country as a whole. And I blame the "whatever the market will bear" mindset.

I'm sure Moe will disagree. He always does. I can only assume he is a one percent that thinks paying 90,000 for new Suburban is OK. Jeez, it's a Chevy truck. We paid $2,700.00 for a new Chevy truck in '67. Back then we'd work about 2200 hours to pay for it. Now a minimum wage earner needs to work about 6000 hours. That is not parity. What changed? "Whatever the market will bear"

What's wrong with fair market value? What's wrong with doing something for the country as a whole? What's wrong with acknowledging our veterans and the sacrifices they made individually for our country as a whole? Not a thing.

Oh, and tax the rich!!?? Oh he!! no. That means the government gets the money and they have NO fiscal responsibility.  It needs to go back to the institutions that started this me, me, me crap. They need to instill a sense of personal responsibility to this country. Will it ever happen? No. Not in my or my children's lifetime.

But thanks for giving me the opportunity to blow that bit of rant off my chest.

 :soap:  OFF

 LOL Pete, there must have been a post of yours somewhere back in the archives of B&B that I've agreed with you, but I'll be damned if I can remember even one, it would be a rare moment indeed, however it may surprise you to hear that this is one of those rare times when we share some common ground.
 I can remember clearly the day I picked up my first new pick up truck, I was 30 yrs. old and up until then I had never paid more than $500.00 for any of my used cars or trucks, so is was a big day for me in my life at the time, it was a brandy new Ford F-250 with a custom cab and style side bed, when I drove it out of the dealership I felt like a very rich young man, I've had new and much more expensive cars since, but that pick up has always remained my favorite vehicle of all time, well, it and some of my motorcycles.
 That new Ford cost me all of $3225.00 out the door, today it would cost me about $70,000.00, and like you, it really pisses me off, but so does paying $5.40 a gallon for home heating oil, $5.00 a gallon for gas at the pump, and the coming 60% increase in my monthly electric bills.
 So, mark this day on your Calendar my friend, days like this don't come around very often.   :cheers:
In youth we learn,   with age we understand.

Offline boomer

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Re: December 7, 1941
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2022, 08:18:22 AM »
Well now, Agreement?  Amen to that.

We look at what things cost because we're faced with that direct impact every single day. But often the complete costs go way beyond money even if they're a bit harder to see or more uncomfortable to consider.

Changes in economic policies adopted by the 1970s and reflected in the pickup stories a lot of us can share are part of adopting the "Neoliberal (it is neither neo nor liberal) Economics" policies. and the complete shift away from the society that elected Ike. It is a policy that has never worked in any single place or nation ever tried except to produce autocracy, conflict and despair for the majority of Citizens.  Which simply means it has worked as intended. We called it Trickle Down Economics. Those changes in economic policies reflected a basic philosophical shift. 

Today in our nation 3 people control more wealth than 50% of the population, 10% of of citizens control more non home  ownership based wealth than 90% of the population and the top 1% control 70% of that. This is not supposition or propaganda. It is arithmetic and well documented. What does that mean for the rest of us? Kind of obvious I think. 

When a sitting President voices disdain for the Constitution calling it "Just a piece of paper"   As GW Bush did or a former President says its time to abrogate the Constitution entirely as Trump just did Citizens might benefit from paying attention.

Among folks here and Citizens in general there is actually much we agree on. Never going to be everything but that's just the way people are. Those things we agree on we can work  together toward insuring they become policy. Those things we don't agree on we can work on to resolve.  We, all of  us, are going to have to learn to do that if we want any hope of restoring the promises of the Constitution that we have allowed to be taken from us.

None of this is about labels or even the two allowed political parties  It is about our shared responsibilities as Citizen, respect for each other and leaving a stronger Nation for those who follow.

WE lead the politicians, they do not DICTATE to us.  Time to remember that.

1918 ended The War To End All wars. 1945 ended the war to preserve democracy. Millions died in those conflicts. Maybe we owe them something better than we're doing today.


Offline Moe M.

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Re: December 7, 1941
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2022, 07:08:32 AM »
Well now, Agreement?  Amen to that.

We look at what things cost because we're faced with that direct impact every single day. But often the complete costs go way beyond money even if they're a bit harder to see or more uncomfortable to consider.

Changes in economic policies adopted by the 1970s and reflected in the pickup stories a lot of us can share are part of adopting the "Neoliberal (it is neither neo nor liberal) Economics" policies. and the complete shift away from the society that elected Ike. It is a policy that has never worked in any single place or nation ever tried except to produce autocracy, conflict and despair for the majority of Citizens.  Which simply means it has worked as intended. We called it Trickle Down Economics. Those changes in economic policies reflected a basic philosophical shift. 

Today in our nation 3 people control more wealth than 50% of the population, 10% of of citizens control more non home  ownership based wealth than 90% of the population and the top 1% control 70% of that. This is not supposition or propaganda. It is arithmetic and well documented. What does that mean for the rest of us? Kind of obvious I think. 

When a sitting President voices disdain for the Constitution calling it "Just a piece of paper"   As GW Bush did or a former President says its time to abrogate the Constitution entirely as Trump just did Citizens might benefit from paying attention.

Among folks here and Citizens in general there is actually much we agree on. Never going to be everything but that's just the way people are. Those things we agree on we can work  together toward insuring they become policy. Those things we don't agree on we can work on to resolve.  We, all of  us, are going to have to learn to do that if we want any hope of restoring the promises of the Constitution that we have allowed to be taken from us.

None of this is about labels or even the two allowed political parties  It is about our shared responsibilities as Citizen, respect for each other and leaving a stronger Nation for those who follow.

WE lead the politicians, they do not DICTATE to us.  Time to remember that.

1918 ended The War To End All wars. 1945 ended the war to preserve democracy. Millions died in those conflicts. Maybe we owe them something better than we're doing today.

 LOL, I guess we are back to our regular programing.   :soap:  :rolleyes:
In youth we learn,   with age we understand.